Cold starting...

[Big]

OK guys..it's official..my truck just doesn't start well now it's like 0 degs:damnit: ..starts beautifull when warm but now it's cold it always takes about 3-4 goes from ign(I think the fuel drains back into the tank when left over night-easy fix..none return valve)then when it is actually going(after hearing the fuel pump going and priming)..revs are very low-ecu then trys to raise the revs(as a choke might do) then it conks out..Only after doing this for a couple to 3-4 times it then settles down(cylinders must be warmer)..How can i check the cold start setup..On the diagrams it mentions a Cold start timer/switch..whats this..?is it actually on the motor?or is it like a seperate item that I think i'm gonna have to try and get..any info would be awesome..:feedback: thansk for you time and help..cheerzz

 

[Muzza_NZ]

The cold start injector needs to be fed 12V (with ignition on) which is series connected to the brown thermo sender on the water bridge. It might need a ground too.

 

[Big]

Thanks Muzz :006: but I do have power and switched to that wire..what it was..(i think) was the ICV was sticking and when i took it off to have a look was dirty..cleaned it and a drop of WD40 just on the shaft..seems to have fixed it..won't know till the engine is cold..LOL..hope it has anyway..cherz all:smokin:

 

[Big]

No sure if it has worked out..just tryed it and I'm convenced it was 100% cold..but it didn't raise the revs..so will try it in the morning..looking like it will be around -10 degs..too bloody cold..any other ideas to check..?I'm hoping the black thing above the water bridge is the ICV?(Idle Control Valve..?)is this correct..?could it be something else..look forward to your thoughts and ideas..cheersss:bling:

 

[gloverman]

Can you please start the vehicle and check for power at the IAC. Then leaving the test gear attached and turn the ignition off. The IAC valve should have power for another 5ish seconds. If not give me a call and I will explain - cheers

 

[Big]

Cheerz Kelvin..but when I cleaned the ICV..I missed a little carbon build up on the shaft..just finished pulling it apart and now started the truck..it raced up to about 1700 rpm and is now slowly dropping as it warms..I'll let it cool down to cold and try it again..but I suspect it's all good now..cheers Only thing left to do now is the TB...zzz

 

[Muzza_NZ]

Hi Keri,
I had a spare brown sensor out in the workshop, and measured the resistance so that if you're still having problems you could compare measurements.
P/n is 89462-20030. Cold resistance (ie in the fridge) is ~30 ohms, and in hot water for a minute the resistance changes quickly to ~50 ohms. Someone else might be able to back this up in case this one is faulty.

NickM

 

[sideshow]

12v ignition is wrongggggggggg

there is a black wire it goes to the cold start injector plug at back of engine

dont worry bout the thermal sensor your wastng yr time none of that gets touched when u wire these up unless u pulled it apart and put it back wrong

that black wire needs 12v only when crankin otherwise it will stay on and flood the engine and get hydraulic lock and i think i dont want that

but make sure its only cranking power and u should loose the 12v when u go back to ignition

idle motor controls idle does jack **** if u have problems when trying to start it when cold

if u had idle motor probs it would start normally but then stall

u also need to feed the ecu a crank signal on one of the wires

this might give it extra enrichment and also retard the timing for easier starting

so go over the diagrams and see if u have done that

 

[Big]

Sweet as Sideshow thanks for the tips..I have been checking things(will double ckeck that though- at ig it has 12v but not sure on cranking..) but ATM we're shifting house as well..so i'll leave it if it's not right till we are all settled down in the new shoe box..LOL(my house(now sold) is 270m2 new is about 90 m2..LOL one step backwards to go forwards..)May the force be with you...hehe feeling a little cosmic..LOL cheerzz
Also..if an aftermarket temp censor was used instead of the original one..1 would it make any diff to how the engine runs?(I busted the original one getting it out to put the temp sender with my gauge in..(at this stage it runs nicely except when cold..but i'm just thinking about economy and seeing as the thermostat problems I had and now fixed added about 150 - 200 km to the economy/tank..I can relocate the sender for my gauge else where but just seeing if the ecu needs a particular temp range..etc etc..will keep ya'll posted..cheers

 

[Muzza_NZ]

The Green temp sender is the one that the ECU needs, so as long as it's still connected and functioning, the ECU will be happy.

 

[Big]

I'll need to find a replacement then..it broke when I removed it to put in the aftermarket one..zz no problem though..cheers

 

[Big]

Ok I did a startup and it still looked dodgyuppy_dog_eyes: ...also I do have a constant 12v feed to the ICV..which by going by what sideshow says is wrong:kabong: ..will have to change this to switched along side the starter motor..there abouts..Got a water temp fitting coming for the gauge water temp and are waiting for gloverman:cool2: (will try you again tonight) to check his phone or order a new original temp sender to go where it suppose to..no time right now due to moving house..keep ya'll posted..cheerz happy dayzzzz:sigh1:

 

[sideshow]

the idle motor needs 12vs to the 2 black red wires

the cold start injector which is totally different needs 12vs when crankin only

 

[Big]

OK.. i have found the wire that turns the fuel pump on feeding the cold start injector..BUT i'm still looking for the cold start time switch..? is it part of the ecu?(pin number would help..!)Thing is..I have jerry rigged it to the starter relay..:nutkick: and when i start it(wire pulled going to the starter motor)it in turn turns the fuel pump on dumping fuel..(Good thing right..?)BUT when the key is starting I have no prob..thing is when it goes to ON then the cold start injector then turns off..ZZZZZ..looking at the diagram..where is the timer switch..?How long does it operate the cold start injector for?is it a part of the ecu or a bit thats in the engine bay?could I hook up a timer seperately to the ecu to control that side of things..?also I did have the starter motor AND it was running almost like running on with the starter motor trying to crank at the same time..?it's like looking for a needle in a hay stack(timer switch..)any help would be helpfull..will keep on trying to find the pin that obviously has a delayed off which in turn feeds the cold start injector..(now i have found the wire that feeds it..LOL) cheerz all:fest30:

 

[Muzza_NZ]

cold start circuit

Hi Keri,
the timer switch/thermo switch is the brown plugged one in the water bridge. It has a bi-metal strip in it that will open when hot due to water temp, or when current passes through it for a time. It measures ~30 ohms when cold and ~50 ohms when hot, or after bimetal strip opens due to load current. You only need it until the engine fires.

See my awesome mspaint pic attached for a diagram. Sorry no wire colours. This is how I've wired mine. As sideshow says, it's only powered when cranking.

Nick M

 

[Big]

Thanks Muzza..had a nice wee chat with Kelvin and I think I've got it now..will double check in the morning also..does the Cold start cycle add more fuel when It's running but very cold..like the old style choke?..reason I ask is that currently I have it working(i think) and when it was still chilled,it fired up better but when I worked the throttle..it still had like..needed more fuel to run due to being colder..(I hope that made sence)..will keep ya'll posted..cheers K

OH another thing I have a code 22...2 short flashs followed br a longer flasf then 2 more shorties..Thanks to Kelvin to get these..but it's saying the temp sencer ?is that the one in the radiator?or the one with the brown plug on the water bridge?not sure..cheers

 

[gloverman]

Hello Keri

Temp senser is the Green one (EFI temp sensor)
Clear the ECU and see if it returns and replace if it does.
Cold start injector is only when the engine is cranking.
I sold two more conversions after talking to you tonight. Both 4x4

Cheers
Kelvin

 

[sideshow]

green plug iscoolant


one in radiator is for hydro fan ecu

brown is for cold start timer

cold star only when cranking

maybe u should just go over it all test voltages at ecu since u donr know hal the sensors


its much easier to just test voltages at ecu than pull half the crap off theengine

 

[gloverman]

Sideshow I have the pin voltage charts at work for Keri which I printed out today. I will get the info down to him this week which will help his search. He was testing voltages over the phone very fast today when we where talking. He has done a bloody good job getting the truck to where it is now. I wish I could do his job as well as he can do ours. Cheers

 

[Big]

Hello Keri

Temp senser is the Green one (EFI temp sensor)
Clear the ECU and see if it returns and replace if it does.
Cold start injector is only when the engine is cranking.
I sold two more conversions after talking to you tonight. Both 4x4

Cheers
Kelvin

Nice one Kelvin..I'll clear the ecu and try it again..might be in need of a new senser..hehe wink wink..hehe

Thanks Sideshow..I'm going to go over everything after this..just never done this before and it's like ..."I'm not going to let a peice of metal beat me"..lol BTW i love your humor..it's hilarious..hehe

Once it is BUG free and running how i want it to..I'm going to de loom it and cut everything out and tidy it up..still thinnking of putting the auto in when I SC it..M90's calling my name lately..it's getting louder every time I take it out for a thrash..LOL cheers