Its done!! T70 with a 50mm gate.

[ozvenom]

Well guys it been about 18 months since i bought my first t70 and finally we have some dyno results that are real and some thing i can belive.
The car is a friends venom cobra with a 1uz backed by a tremec 3550 5speed and a r32 gtr skyline rear end. it has autronic sm2 ecu and has made 225 Hp at the wheels natrally asperated.
i mounted the turbo in front of the negine with 4into1 1 3/4 headers leading into 2 1/2 " y pipe which has a divider where the 2 sides merge giving a true splitpulse to the turbo. a 3" dump pipe which splits into 2 2 1/2 " pipes which then joint the original 21/2 exhaust system.
The engine is stock except bigger injectors. intercooler is a tube and fin measureing 600 x 300 x 65. not huge but big enough.
the waste gate has a 7psi spring so it makes .5 bar boost. a boost contoler will be fitted this week so bigger boost levels are coming.
So what did it make 322 rwhp and 1566ft/lbs of torque at the wheels.
it also had 5psi by 2000rpm so it get going early with the split pulse system.
all in all i am very happy with the way the turbo perfomed . only thing now is its durability ,at 7psi should not be a problem.
Regards oz.

 

[Pro]

awesome! great work.

any pics of the install at all to share with the rest of us?

how were your inlet temps?

 

[Toysrme]

Soooooooo
1438 lb-ft @ 4050rpm *bullsh*t*
332rwhp @ 4900rpm
Torque= (5252 x HP)/RPM
wheel torque = 355 lb-ft @ 4900rpm. NOT 1438, or 1566ft @ 4050rpm, or any other outrageous figure. THAT IS NOT A TURBO DIESEL.
I'm use to reading Australian, Asian & European dynos because I've been reading them for a long time... but that is THE most inaccurate, f***ed up thing I've ever seen. A freaking Gtech pro would have been easier to read, and honestly, way more accurate.

Um, piss-poor dyno aside.

That's really cool!!! Show some pics of the caaaar!






Also, I'm trying to understand. What are the final power figures for the car going to be? A T70 is huge for only make 330whp. Those things make >700 without breathing hard up their boost chart. I'm just curious.

 

[MaxPower]

I take it you have never heard of gearing Toys?? The 1566lb of torque is after going through a 4.11:1 rear end or whatever a R32 has. A T70 is gonna be pretty lazy at 7psi, wait till its boosted and it will be far more efficient.


In any case thats a great result at low boost. And getting 5psi at 2000RPM will make it a pretty damn fun car to drive, nice work!

 

[340i]

great effort! its interesting that you get boost so early with such a big turbo. i was surprised that the torque dropped off after 4000rpm or so, and power stayed linear after there right up to almost 7000. i would have thought you'd get more of a rise up to and over 6000ish rpm with that setup. could there be something limiting the power in this fashion, or is this what happens with turbo 1uz's?

 

[ozvenom]

real world power.

Thanks max power you saved someone from getting a teardown by me.
thats correct it is rear wheel torque and horsepower. And it is 4.11 : 1 diff ratio.
The dyno that was used is regarded as a very accurate dyno.
When you have driven a car with nearly 2 thousand nm's of torque and weighs in at 2200 lbs then you can tell me bull sh#*. I have and being able to light the the rear tyres at 120 mph is more than enough proof that torque is king when it comes shear driving pleasure.
I was hoping to help others on the forum by giving out the specs of the design as much as i have read some negative comments about the t70 i wanted to wait and see for my self what it is capable of. And i can wait to get one on my sports sedan as it only weighs in at 1760 lbs plus driver .

Any intelligent questions will be answered.

Pics are on the way.

Regards oz

 

[ozvenom]

boost

Hi 340i the reason it flatens out is it is only making 7 psi boost and the wastegate is holding from making any more once more boost is dialed in the torque wont change much but the power will just keep on going up.
The only limiting factor is the combination of compression ratio and boost to the quality or octane of the fuel . timing is very conservitive .

Regard oz

 

[krayn]

Hi Oz
Great results well done. The t70 you are using, is this a ss auto chrome turbo from ebay ect or is it a proper garret t70????
What size injectors are you running and do you happen to know what duty cycle they are at max power????
Im running what sounds like a similar system but do not have the good exhaust manifold just the modified crown ones, and the standard 251 cc injectors. I am wiring up the wolf 3d ecu at the moment and I am interested how other similar systems have gone. Im hoping for 400 flywheel hp, By all accounts this should be achievable and sounds like youve achieved this. Keep up the good work. Reguard kris.

 

[Toysrme]

Language

I wasn't bashing him, or the car, but that doesn't change the fact that the dyno is piss-poor, inaccurate, and now you both are also wrong...
What are you guys talking about gearing... That is measuring WHEEL power AFTER gearing.
Horsepower is a function of torque applied over both time & distance. They are directly related. If he were MAKING 1438 lb-ft of torque @ 4050rpm, he show himself making
Horsepower = rpm x torque / 5252
(1438/5252)*4050
0.273 * 4050 = 1105.65 wheel horsepower.
THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
Chassie dynos work by finding horsepower - then using math to find torque. Horsepower is always "correct" as the dyno reads it. Torque is derived from it.


Don't tell me about gearing does this, or gearing does that, that's bulls**t. It's BASIC math... The dyno sucked is the problem.
If he were to have spun his tires all over that thing, horsepower rises in proportion torque - as we've just proven 100% by math - horsepower would have read 1100.
That doesn't even look like when a torque convertor gives torque multiplication for a brief instance. That happens the instance power is applied i.e. the very start of the dyno, and again "horsepower rises in proportion torque - as we've just proven 100% by math - horsepower would have read 1100."



All I'm saying & have proven, regardless of what other lunacy you guys speak to cover for the ass-tastic dyno, is the dyno sucked. The car sounds cool as hell & I want to see it not to take away from the car... but, that dyno is ludicrous, so are your posts about gearing's affect on dyno results.










And can't either damn one of you tell me about driving a car with 2000nm of torque, when his car is making
THREE HUNDRED AND FIFTY FIVE
@ 4900rpm. Quit bitching & talking dumb things. Nothing is more constant than basic math... When basic math tells you you're wrong. YOU'RE WRONG!

ROTFLMAO!

 

[chrisman]

great! results so far-- ESPECIALY for .5 bar boost.. it sounds like your setup is very capable of BIG numbers and ALOT of fun on the street...sounds abit SCARY also-- be carefull with the car--breaking the tires loose at 120 mph would make my hands abit difficult to pry from the steering wheel..

 

[jibby]

Show us some pics............

 

[Lextreme II]

Awesome results.... you have stock internals?

 

[MaxPower]

toys, first up take a chill pill and mellow out some!

Now, a dyno measures torque not power, horsepower is the calculated figure. So this torque measurement will change depending on gear ratio and you get a figure that represents the wheel torque like in the graph posted.

You have already established that horsepower = rpm x torque / 5252. Now think about how a dyno is measuring the RPM component of this for its calculation - its the roller RPM, it is NOT the engine RPM, the engine RPM (in the above graph is only for your viewing pleasure) is again calculated based on gearing but the roller RPM is used for the HP calculation, how else would you get a useful power reading with varying diff ratios or gearbox ratios?? Based on your logic dropping to a lower gear should give you extra HP because of the extra torque multiplication, would sure make it easier for tuners to make HP on paper!

Lets do some simple math to prove this using the dyno numbers above and the equation you gave, we will assume the dyno roller diameter to be the same as the wheel to keep things simple.
HP = (Roller RPM * Torque) / 5252
So HP = [(engine RPM / gearbox ratio / diff ratio) * TQ] / 5252

Example 1)
1:1 gearbox ratio, 4.11 rear end, 1438 TQ, 4050 engine RPM.
HP = [ (4050/4.11/1) * 1438 ] / 5252 = 269.8HP

Example 2)
1:1 gearbox ratio, 4.56 rear end, torque is multiplied by gearing so is now 1595 TQ [(1438/4.11)*4.56], 4050 engine RPM
HP = [ (4050/4.56/1) * 1595 ] / 5252 = 269.7HP



I think basic math shows me exactly whats going on, the mega $$ dyno is correct in the way it calculates HP based on the TORQUE at the wheels reading it makes :veryhappy

 

[Toysrme]

That is the dumbest post I've read in weeks, from someone that thinks he knows something. What makes it sad is that you are just |----| close from using the math you just used correctly, yet so far! ROTFLMAO!

Congratulations, my day has been made LoL!

 

[jibby]

MaxPower vs. Toysrme......... who is right and who is wrong?

And the winner is Toysrme!!!!!......Torque is always derived from horsepower....

 

[superlex1]

Ozvenom like your work, i could only ever dream to have a turbo of my 1UZ. The torque multiplication that these engine produce is possible when being boosted, its crazy but true. I would get some backup though as i have never heard of Dyno Logic Chassis Dyno before? I would suggest to call James at BPS in Cleveland 34882911 he has a Dyno Dynamics Machine and is accredited to do full Shot-Out mode, so you can prove to all the beast has some real nuts with real results

 

[MaxPower]

That is the dumbest post I've read in weeks

Funny, I was thinking the same thing after reading your post.

......Torque is always derived from horsepower....

ummmm not when we are talking dyno's its not. I can assure you a dyno measures torque and calculates power. A chassis dyno like what was used in the graph posted uses roller RPM and torque on a load arm in the retarder to measure torque.

 

[rdm20fan]

My 1UZ-fe made 321 RWHP, and I think 312 RWTQ at 7-8 PSI on 2 CT-26's I'm sure a single T-70 will make a little more, but Did they do the dyno pull in a lower gear 1st or 2nd? this would throw off the torque alot
I'm running the stock lexus SC gear 3:93?

 

[Anaema]

isnt torque derived more from stroke than HP? the 13B rotary engine for example. its has almost no stroke, so it has little torque. same for a 2.5L F1 V8. but on a GM 572 Big block, it makes gobs of torque and less HP. an even better example is a diesel engine. big stroke, low HP, monster torque. but still, those numbers do seem fake.

 

[jibby]

I am aware that changing a torque converter, changing differential gearing, tranny, drivetrain, etc... can create more lowend torque but that doesn't change the power output of the engine, just the torque at the rear wheels.. That is what I learned in first grade.... There is hp measured at the chasis, crank, rear wheep hp, which is abbreviated whp, and rwhp. Could this all be a big misunderstanding?

I am not an expert on dyno's but know a little and what toysrme said makes perfect sense to me.... I have been in many battling threads and this is one I want to stay out of, and would like to be more of a spectator from the sidelines. Anyway, Maxpower it sounds like you have a nice powerful ride with alot of potential regardless of this dyno posted... Good job Maxpower.......