Fly by Wire to Pedal questions

[duza]

I've done some searching but got nowhere, so I hope someone can help.
I'm in the process of fitting a VVTi motor into my94 Hilux. I have 2 options for the accelerator pedal.

The first is to source a fly by wire pedal box from something and adapt it to the existing setup, but I have no idea what would be compatible.

The second is to use a different throttle body, one which uses a throttle cable. This would also solve my cruise control connection issues. However, I have no idea what throttle body would fit. Any ideas, please, guys. Gloverman mentioned something about a 4lt UZs20 throttle body, but Google doesn't recognise that at all, so I don't know what motor it is, or if it would be available in Australia.
I'm going to go aftermarket ECU, so TPS, etc should not be an issue, but because the intake is at the front of the motor, any throttle body needs to be relatively short, cos there isn't a huge amount of room between the front of the motor to the radiator.
Ric

 

[gloverman]

Are you doing a 1uz or 3uz VVti? Do you have your motor?

 

[duza]

Kelvin,
3UZs in Aus are like hens teeth still. You guys seem to have the monopoly on them. I have a 97ish 1UZ complete with wiring and security key etc. The vehicle it's going into is a 94 Hilux with independent front end. It already has an earlier model 1UZ and auto, which I fitted about 5 years ago. As much as I'd like to fit the new 5 speed auto into as well, I think adapting the output of the auto to the input of the transfer case will be too involved, so I will end up using the older 4 speed which is already in the ute. This will likely be an inexpensive and straight forward transplant. Engine mounts etc will all be the same and tailshafts will not have to be altered again. I won't even need to get it engineered.
The only real issue is the accelerator pedal/fly by wire issue. I haven't got the Lexus pedal assembly, so fitting that to the Hilux is not an option, unless I was lucky enough to find one secondhand somewhere, or was able to adapt one from a different Toyota. So, fitting a cable type throttle box would be the answer, if there was such a beast which could be bolted straight on.
Hoping you have some answers.

Ric

 

[gloverman]

The 1uz VVti engines we see from UCF20/21 and UZS151 run a throttle cable to the throttle body with the APS and Sub APS fitted onto the TB so a normal hilux pedal box works. The ECU then controls the throttle plate motor and clutch assembly which is on the other side of the TB. We use the factory TB in all the hilux conversions we do without an issue.

Are you going to wire the non VVti ECT to run the gearbox? Do you have a ECU that runs the DBW setup? I mainly do stock ECU but have done a few aftermarkets too with full DBW and it is a pain to setup the first time but once done works real cool.

The 3UZ require a different pedal and only run a Throttle plate motor on the TB. We have heaps of 3UZs over here. Very easy to get hold of. I have one here on my engine stand and three 1uz VVti to wire with stock ecu and 1 with aftermarket(plus others to do). Less time on internet for me more time wiring. Cheers

 

[duza]

[/IMG]


Kelvin,
Here are some photos of my TB. There appears to be a place on the end to fit a cable, but only one, but it does not directly operate the butterfly in the TB. What about my cruise control cable? Where would it go?

Mark from MRC Dynos in Castle Hill has suggested I should use the old 1UZ ECU from my non VVTi motor to control the 4 speed auto and use a Link to control the motor. This is maybe why he thinks I will need a different TB. Sorry, I have no idea how the link will control a DBW TB. Is this the best way to go, or can you suggest an easier and or cheaper solution, bearing in mind I do not want to manually shift the auto gears and like the idea that an aftermarket ECU should make more power and can be tuned to suit the 4x4.

Cheers Ric

 

[gloverman]

Yep thats a factory 1uz VVti throttle body. I can give you photos of about 3 I have sitting around.
The cable fitting on that TB is for the throttle cable. They dont run a cruise control cable. Factory the LS400 or celsoir would simply drive the throttle plate Via the DBW for the cruise control. They also dont run a pressure cable to the trans on the 5 speeds. You will need to make up a bracket and linkage to fit the cable from the 4 speed trans onto the TB. The reason that it doesnt operate the throttle plate is the Cable is connectted to the APS and the throttle plate is driven by the ECU ( hence DBW) they are alot like the altezza TB.
The APS will contact the throttle plate after about 80% opening as a fail safe. In practice this will never happen as the motor will open the throttle plate ahead of the APS linkage making contact. Also I dont recommend pulling it apart if you intend to run it as a DBW. They are quite sensitve on the settings.
Ive only done DBW on 1uz VVti and used a link everytime. They work fine with that TB. The DBW controls the idle and the angle of throttle can be altered relative to the pedal angle.
The Factory mapping also works real well on 4x4 with excellant bottom end torque. We even have a trials truck over here running one stock ECU. Im working on a test vehicle to compare link with stock ECU. I would guess there is about 10% difference.
The link will need a E-throttle unit to do the DBW. I was one of the early guys to do a 1uz with DBW and they did some confirguration with one of my TBs. There is also a clutch unit in the TB.

Hope that helps.

 

[duza]

Thanks for the info. The only thing I didn't understand was "E throttle unit".
What is that?

 

[gloverman]

using a link extreme the Older silver series had the hardware to run E-throttle inside the ECU on AUX9&10. The newer Red series extreme they reduced the price and removed the E-throttle control. The E-throttle unit is now an external module. Cheers

 

[gloverman]

I know how to sort it. Buy me airline tickets and ill come over with a premade loom, fit it and get it running. Problem solved.

 

[duza]

Don't you have a Kayak? It's not that far.

Sideshow will most likely be doing the wiring when he comes down from QLD, so I'm sure he'll be able to sort it out.

So, when I buy the Link, I need to also buy an External E throttle control. Is that available from the Link people? Sorry about all the ignorant questions, but this will be my first conversion using aftermarket engine control.

You also mentioned an approx 10% power increase over the factory ECU. MRC reckons he can just about guarantee 200 RWKW. Do you think that is obtainable?
I'm not interested in smoking tyres, but I do tow a rather heavy Coromal windup camper and the extra power over my old UCF10 would be very handy.
Ric

 

[gloverman]

Check with Jim what he wants as he is wiring it. I can only recommend how I would do it. If I was making a recommendation I would get you a E-throttle unit as well as the X-treme, a map sensor of some sort and and Air temp sensor. Im having a run on links at the moment. One X-treme down and on more to go then onto the Storms. Also sold a MX5 plug in today.

As for power output people throw around numbers and different operators can change settings to get different outputs. Toyota Rate these engines at 300Hp at the crank. 200RWkw is 260HP at the wheels so it doesnt allow for much drive line loss. Tyre sizes can also make a difference. The figures I have seen which seem about right is the 1uz VVti just under the 200RWkw(manual) with much better torque than the early motors and the 3uz just over 200. The old slushy box takes a bit of Hp to drive. The end figure doesnt matter as it will have alot more sting than the old non VVti engine.

Im sure if Jim needs some advice he will phone me. Cheers