cam, spring, retainer combo

[redrocco]

I have spent days reading and searching the info on cams, valve springs retainers, shim over/under bucket, shimless buckets and now I am even more confused then I was before. I am planning on ordering a set of Kelford 207-S1 supercharged cams. Kelford says that these cams should work with the stock valve train but I would like to play it safe. I plan on running about 12 to 14 PSI of boost and my redline is set at 8000 RPM. I don't need to go ballz to the wall crazy but some springs and retainers that are going to do the job but not break the bank would probably be a good idea. I have looked at the cribbj posted and could not figure out what to use. Would the stock retainers work with the Ferrea S10110 springs? Will the stock retainers hold up? Trying to stay within a budget of $300 to $500 for springs and retainers. What do you all think?

 

[redrocco]

I could also get the Lextreme regrind stage 2 FI cams the lextreme springs and the lextreme retainers for about the same price as the kelford cams. This may be the best option for the money. Some things I have heard in the past in the VW world tell me that regrind cams are a bad idea. But Lextreme seams to put out good parts and there are a number of people who have bought his cams and I have not herd of any problems. Also the stock VW cams are probbly not as beefy as the lexus cams. For only $1300 for cams, springs and retainers I would be a fool not to look into them.

Anyone have any tips for what I should do.

 

[CarlosR347]

I could also get the Lextreme regrind stage 2 FI cams the lextreme springs and the lextreme retainers for about the same price as the kelford cams. This may be the best option for the money. Some things I have heard in the past in the VW world tell me that regrind cams are a bad idea. But Lextreme seams to put out good parts and there are a number of people who have bought his cams and I have not herd of any problems. Also the stock VW cams are probbly not as beefy as the lexus cams. For only $1300 for cams, springs and retainers I would be a fool not to look into them.

Anyone have any tips for what I should do.

I second his question I too am looking into this option aswell Im running a single Borg Warner S366 im seeking 700rwhp i have a 92 engine stock heads, internals, and intake, i have 10mm arp studs and cometic mls, so far ive only gone to 11psi and its held up fine no signs of heads lifting..

 

[ash]

Stock retainers and valves being used on 55 psi boost engines, that get shifted at 10,500 rpm....

 

[ash]

If this link works, this car has oem valves, retainers
Rpm to 9600
45+ psi boost
1 uz heads, block , crank

 

[ash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxHvdiePe3c

 

[XR8tt]

Ash is right with drag racing especially where engine is run over short duration...
I was just saying what we used and went about it..
What I spent even though most was at mates rates or less...
I could have bought some latter model heads...
Seems as said CAMS, Valve springs and some mild porting, virtually polishing
is all that's required..

 

[ash]

Ash is right with drag racing especially where engine is run over short duration...
I was just saying what we used and went about it..
What I spent even though most was at mates rates or less...
I could have bought some latter model heads...
Seems as said CAMS, Valve springs and some mild porting, virtually polishing
is all that's required..

Yes, just trying to give cheap ideas that work...
Btw... Some of these heads have no porting.

 

[ash]

Ash is right with drag racing especially where engine is run over short duration...
..

The shims used for adjustment in these over bucket engines, are still original.
No wear , no chipping, breakage.
Being a non rollerized valve train, certain types of oils are best used for longevity .

Soooo, short duration comment is wrong.
Look at fopar 's brother engine......

 

[XR8tt]

Not entirely wrong..
That Capri is NO daily driver...
What I'm saying is some are reading this and think I can build a
800 h.p engine and go out and drive the living guts out of it because
they see either alcohol or E85 well tuned and looked after drag vehicles
last...
Nothing wrong with over engineering...
Besides all this valve gear can be obtained from NZ ll engines now...

Myself I understand what your saying..
But this is a bulletin board and others can read this...

Wish I practised what I did to this engine..
I reco'd my my 94 WRX STI engine and didn't check buckets !!!
Ahh tappet noise on new forged engine!!!
Like the heads can come off easy on a boxer engine !!

 

[ash]

That Capri is NO daily driver...
!

Really??.......

 

[FoPar]

Not entirely wrong..
That Capri is NO daily driver...
What I'm saying is some are reading this and think I can build a
800 h.p engine and go out and drive the living guts out of it because
they see either alcohol or E85 well tuned and looked after drag vehicles
last...
Nothing wrong with over engineering...
Besides all this valve gear can be obtained from NZ ll engines now...

Myself I understand what your saying..
But this is a bulletin board and others can read this...

Wish I practised what I did to this engine..
I reco'd my my 94 WRX STI engine and didn't check buckets !!!
Ahh tappet noise on new forged engine!!!
Like the heads can come off easy on a boxer engine !!

are you serious, the Capri is well maintained? it did just under 10k in street driving last year, 100 1/4 mile passes, 50 dyno runs. powercruise/supernats events were it had the guts thrashed out if it. the only maintenance is put petrol in, and it gets new coolant, oil and gearbox oil every 5k. mind you not once has it ever needed it. it has over 30k and 200 passes in the last 3 years and it hasnt been pulled down yet. i know guys with factory street cars who treat there cars better

could it be a daily? yes, put a ZF 6-speed box in it for example and why not? that is the only reason it's not driven anymore every day because of the 2-speed.

you know wots funny, i have read so much crap from so called experts on these forums, honestly they must pick the worst engine builders in the history of the world. we have a 1200hp combo the heads apart from valve springs and a mild port job are stock? how the hell can we pull it off when everyone else reckons you need to do a complete overhaul? what makes us so special compared to everyone else?

 

[XR8tt]

I'm not saying that it's not a top combo...
Most these engines are...
The thing is ..
Do you really know whats put into it before bagging me..
I went along with what cam experts said to do..
Nothing other than that..
Kelford etc should know what is required..
All I did was get heads CNC'd and used stainless valves at a bargain price..
assembled with 2J valve springs as no supplier at the time didn't have any..
It's fairly easy to say now that the spring seat should have been CNC'd deeper so
local springs would fit .. Live and learn...
Kelford said the cam profile would require shimless or shim under buckets..
I'm not trying to be the pioneer here.. Just ptting together something that
works and get up the Chevy guys which takes some beating..
The OP asked what was required and I said what we've done...
Thats all...
I've been around performance engines for over 45 years...
This internet has only got me interested only due to my interest in performance
cars... Any way we had a top day out at Kandos...
This car nearly set the whole town on fire..

;

 

[FoPar]

Don't worry about him mate,
We all know what Joe's car can do
Apart from being the fastest true street car in Australia I would say.... It goes to show, what can be done with real data.

not just real data, but common sense and understanding. there is guys out there doing more to their 500hp 1UZ's than we have had done on ours the Capri spins to 9000rpm sometimes on the track, what normal street/strip car will spin that high. we haven't opened the head up, but im pretty positive it hasn't spat a shim out yet

do i think an 800hp can be driven on the street and not have issues, yes, if built right it sure can.

 

[XR8tt]

not just real data, but common sense and understanding. there is guys out there doing more to their 500hp 1UZ's than we have had done on ours the Capri spins to 9000rpm sometimes on the track, what normal street/strip car will spin that high. we haven't opened the head up, but im pretty positive it hasn't spat a shim out yet

do i think an 800hp can be driven on the street and not have issues, yes, if built right it sure can.

Good ole turbo's...
Who knows with lighter valve train I may have better combo ???Lol...

 

[FoPar]

Good ole turbo's...
Who knows with lighter valve train I may have better combo ???Lol...

why? all we did was change springs and it's making around 1150 E85 on 30psi. factory shit works well for us.

 

[XR8tt]

why? all we did was change springs and it's making around 1150 E85 on 30psi. factory shit works well for us.

Yea BUT both of us didn't know that at the time...
Plus you did up grade the turbo's..
Nothing wrong with that...Done it myself on my Ford...
And cam originally...

 

[XR8tt]

I have spent days reading and searching the info on cams, valve springs retainers, shim over/under bucket, shimless buckets and now I am even more confused then I was before. I am planning on ordering a set of Kelford 207-S1 supercharged cams. Kelford says that these cams should work with the stock valve train but I would like to play it safe. I plan on running about 12 to 14 PSI of boost and my redline is set at 8000 RPM. I don't need to go ballz to the wall crazy but some springs and retainers that are going to do the job but not break the bank would probably be a good idea. I have looked at the cribbj posted and could not figure out what to use. Would the stock retainers work with the Ferrea S10110 springs? Will the stock retainers hold up? Trying to stay within a budget of $300 to $500 for springs and retainers. What do you all think?

If the cam manu says the std retainers, bucket / shims hold up.. Then yes ..
They had issues about 3 or 4 years back as the valve springs warn't up to the task.. Some engines had spring issues...
But [TMK] Valve Springs Australia have up graded there material quality now.. They told me to send mine back...Which was good of them...

It's when the bucket separates from cam or the cam profile pushing one side of the shim pushing it out in extreme lifts or weak valve springs..
I would say NOT an issue with that profile...

 

[FoPar]

Yea BUT both of us didn't know that at the time...
Plus you did up grade the turbo's..
Nothing wrong with that...Done it myself on my Ford...
And cam originally...

we always had twin 62's. just changed the rears, because it was choking in the deep end. it showed it picked up HP on the dyno, but on the track it only showed a slight improvement. the cams now is smaller than the 2 previous cams.

 

[FoPar]

If the cam manu says the std retainers, bucket / shims hold up.. Then yes ..
They had issues about 3 or 4 years back as the valve springs warn't up to the task.. Some engines had spring issues...
But [TMK] Valve Springs Australia have up graded there material quality now.. They told me to send mine back...Which was good of them...

It's when the bucket separates from cam or the cam profile pushing one side of the shim pushing it out in extreme lifts or weak valve springs..
I would say NOT an issue with that profile...

we go with what the engine builder says. having built numerous hi-po 1UZ engines in his life, we prefer to listen to what he knows compared to what a cam company says.

go with another brand of springs. we run motorbike springs in the Capri