Twin M45 charged 1uzfe project taking shape

[striker]

hmm point taken about KEP, heard it before but when it comes to $$$.... well you know!

I still need to investigate the thicknesses of both plates, and go for the one that will leave enough space for a multiplate clutch, if the original fails.

but first lets do the intake manifold and intercoolers, been bragging about them for so long now that action must be undertaken.

Oh by the way tickets for le-mans are allready ordered, someone from here going?

grtz Thomas

 

[Tonyd]

I will be among 60 Cobras going to the Le Mans Classic in July, I guess you will be going to the the 24 hours in June.

The classic is a much more "cultured" affair, a lot less people, lovely old cars and a far nicer environment than the 24 hours.


And then we arrive.................

Cheers,

Tony

 

[striker]

Hey tony,

As much as would like to go the classics once, it'll be the 24H again this year.

who cares about cultured when you have pescarolo's singing, on the mullsannes with a beer in your hand?

hopfully see you at the classics sometime btw.

Grtz Thomas

 

[striker]

Had some good playtime in the garage making fiddly parts to build up the intercooler system.

The idea is to place the finned core inside a tube, have the airflow over/inbetween the finns and the tube wall, and have coolant flow through the lentghwise holes in the core. the only thing that hasn't been done yet is to machine lengthwise solts in the tubes for the air to enter and exit the heat exchanger.
4 of these will sit side by side on top of the milled down lower intake manifold. which was machiened down by a friend of mine.



Next up: the T6 tubes needed to be cut down in order for 4 of them being able to sit side by side on the intake manifold, and not interfere with the stock fuel rails, which I would like to keep.
also an 2mm alloy airbox will need to be build around the 4 heat exchangers.

so how do you fit 46cm tubes into a 40cm lentgh lathe? well you can. with some imagination.
I got the overall run out on this: buget lathe with a 5 cm overhung and not so acurate tailstock, fitted with a homebrew semi floating tube center, down to about 0.1mm over the total length of 460mm, the run out came when I had to take the tube out and swap it around to machine the part that is clamped in the jaws in this picture. that's close enough for me, as this is my 5th job ever on a lathe.

piccies
tube in lathe (tailstock overhung 5cm)


home made T6 tube center clamped to the normal livecenter.


machining in action, diameter was 48.7mm and had to become 46.0mm made 4 passes on all 4 tubes, and use 2 cans of wd40 to cool everything down during machining, Auto feed is a MUST for this, but set it slow, the swarf coming from the toolbit is vibrating so much it doesn;t show in this picture, it's comming of very steadily without noise which I'm told is good.... ???



quick rub with scotchbrite makes shiny


There was end result on both ends,

saved some weight, had three buckets like this.


but looks the buisness


after that: the Lamionova cores will be inside the tubes, and need to be sealed of on both air and coolant sides. space is very limited and even a millimeter is key on the front side of the intercooler, because the front waterbridge is in the way, I would like to build everthing up keeping as much parts of the engine untouched, so I decided to make the endcap/seals inside the tubes instead of on the ends of it, saves 22mm's in total, but made a more difficult job. I decided on using 2mm thick Orings as seals. I used an online calculator to decide on the sizes of the Oring grooves. I sealed of one tube using these and tested it to 7bar of presure from the compressor they didn't leak so I think I'll be ok, I never build anything like this before so time will tell.......

shamed to say but I'm a little bit proud of myself, very rewarding making such nice looking shiny parts, shame the aren't vissible when in action.

piccies

hacksaw elbow grease 18tpi blade works wonders compared to 29tpi btw


inside of #2 machined to +/-0.02mm of prototype #1. trick is NEVER take it out of the chuck. for outside machining this piece is clamped from inside out in the 3jaw.


#1 & #2 finnished size difference within 0.02mm tollerance is much higher so pleased


from raw material to finnished part YIPPIE


here's where the core Oring sits in the end cap/ring


here's a complete heatexchanger partly assembeld to show how it fits


and for the fun of it a fancy display of parts


i need to make 4 complete sets as theres 4 cores. the proto endcap took 4 hours to make, getting everything to fit smoothly with destroying the Oring during assebly.
once all measurements where OK #2 took 1.5 hours from picking up the hacksaw to fitting the Orings. I think with some training of my right arm I can get that down to 1 hour per piece, so another 6 hours behind the lathe is in order.
One thing is for sure though, the machine has allready payed itself back. and I'm very happy with the quality of it, with some more practice I think I can get even better matching than the 0.02mm I now get.

next up: getting the airbox/manifold made up from 2 or 3 mm sheet alloy, and getting it welded up.

Grtz Thomas

 

[Zuffen]

Outstandinng effort.

I've always lusted after a lathe but just don't have enough work for one.

You sure do.

 

[JustenGT8]

Nice work.....have to admit i can't see how these things flow as well as they say?

 

[striker]

Exactly the reason I bought one Zuffen. the idea is that I can tell my girlfriend that "the more parts I make the cheaper it gets" hihihihi.
there will probably be much more to be turned up before the engine runs.

@Justin,
I was a little skeptical at first to, but when you calculate all numbers the flow area is actually quite large, have the numbers at home so no details at the moment. also Laminova send me a test report on a 4core item which was VERY good, better than anything air/air i could find no matter how big, the desing nature is that turbulence in the airflow in virtually non existing inside the heat exchanger so presure losses are very low at stupid flowrates for the size of the thing it's basicly a 5cm/2" high 40cm/16" long 18cm/7" wide box which is very small,
also efficiency of cooling is very good but also very dependend on desing of the housing the cores sit in and flow rate of the coolant. I plan to run at least 25L/min and get the IC coolant rad big enough to completly cool down to ambient temperature.

this is what laminova themselves state, if the corehousing is up to spec regarding the inner diameter, which makes the gap between the housing and the fins on the cores.

Regarding performance, this depends on what you mean by sufficient cooling, some customers requires charge air temperature into the cylinders very near the coolant temperature (90-95% efficiency!), but this can only be achieved with a very large intercooler. With 4 cores of Ø39.5 – 393 mm at rated air flow rate (892 m³/h = 525cf/m), the pressure drop over the cores will be approx. 4.6 kPa, which is very low, but pressure losses at entrance- and exits plus other losses due to the design of the housing etc. must also be taken into account. Generally you can at least double the pressure drop over the cores to have a fairly good idea of the total pressure drop over the intercooler. So these 4 cores can handle the air flow rate. Regarding cooling capacity, it depends highly on the coolant side conditions, that is flow rate and temperature of the coolant. If we assume 30°C coolant at flow rates between 10 and 30 l/min (small electrical pump, 12 V) the temperature efficiency varies between 70 and 83%, which I think is rather good for this big supercharger.

so hopes up for the performance, I'm shooting for something around 400bhp so the cooler isn't the bottleneck.

Grtz Thomas

 

[spf_lexus]

lots of props! twich turbo is quite a feat but twin, twin screws is just amazing!

 

[striker]

Thanx SPF, I think the engine would do the trick, although I'm not shooting for anything substantial like you see on here sometimes, I think everything above 375hp is bonus. goal is to reach 400 in the end. but if it won't I'm happy with that, just as long as it runs good.

I got a private message from a guy called "hiposilverandaway" I tried to awnser you via private message but lextrem site tells me you have disabled that people send you private messages, so here goes.

Hi Derek,

"Smart aluminium" in australia has the right size tube listed. just google that and you'll find it.

I have machined caps on my lathe for both ends of the core coolant will go in at the cambelt end of the engine and exit at the flywheel end. routing it through 2 and then back through the other 2 isn;t the best Idea, expecially in a V engine. you'd get 2 cores hotter than the other 2 which would mean one bank of cylinders running lean and the other rich.... not a good idea. so 8 caps it is. you need to devide the air from the coolant anyway.

current status is a bit slow because of work/travel stuff at the moment, but I have decided on soldering the tube stack instead of welding, the gap inbetween the core and the housing is so small the tyniest of warpage from welding would mean they cannot fit anymore. soldering at 400degrees on durafix seems a viable option.

what are you building then? and whatsit going to move?

Grtz Thomas

Hi man. I was looking at your post about the cores and was just wondering your current status on it. I'm building a similar setup and I have 4cores I just need to find the scaffold tube for the core. Are you going to machine caps for just one end and have the coolant circulate and exist/enter out the front?

Thanks alot.
Derek

 

[striker]

Update,

just before christmas, my beloved Sylva Striker finaly got sold, so with the funds in hand I orderd a Gardner Douglas chassis and all the bits to build it up to rolling chassis stage. they will need approx 16 weeks to build the chassis (lots is custom such as rollbar heights etc etc)
so I have exactly 3 months to complete the engine hardware...:wtf1:

I bought an aditional nice piece of garage lust! and started right away on the intercooler stack.

the new toy, Gosmeta Bf30 drilling milling combo with a deckel crosstable electrics are an Telemechanique Altivar Frequency drive that takes single phase 230V and puts out 3phase for the machine, it does 1.2KW so torque enough for this little 190cm tall 420kg heavy baby.


I made the flangeplates for the core housing that will hold the 4 alloy tubes. 5mm T6 plate drilled with bi-metal holesaw to 43.5mm diameter, d*mn that makes a mess! still have ally in my hair after 4 days


after that I needed to turn 2 of the tubes further down in oder to get them in there, and make the undercuts from 46mm to 43.5 in order to fit them tightly into the plates. the undercut length was very important otherwise the laminova cores would not fit length wise, a big hassle withou digital readout on the machine but it got there.
when finnished the result was this,



After tackwelding the tubes to the flangeplates I was finnaly ready to mill in the 15mm slots in which the air enters and exits. after this side is done the whole assembly will be turned over and the same thing needs to be done.
thing is I never operated a milling machine before, and I did 15mins of pratice runs on a block of T6 before I took the plunge :nervous:
10mm 4cutter in the collet the Altivar set at 67hz doing about 500rmp's on the spindle and away it go's


the mill is not operating to industry standards and it's an old B****rd but it gets there allbeit SLOWLY
2 hours later (measuring takes up most time the actual machining pass is within a minut per slot-length)


remember that when these 8 are done another 8 are in order..... Anyway the inside of the tube looks clean, no scarfing or chipping so the Laminova's will probably fit straigh away!


I'll get a pro to weld the tubes in place completly because when I screw them up I'd be in trouble. remember I ordered the tube from australia... and I'm in europe + lots of time went into these.....

well that's were it stands so far hope you enjoy reading.

Grtz Thomas

 

[JustenGT8]

Hey Striker,
Good to see you back and right into your proj again.

There's a local guy who is doing awesome work with laminova cores and the ICs he has produced to date have delivered very very impressive results.

Here's the link if you feel like subscribing to toymods

http://www.toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=43226

I looked into him doing a setup for me using the Richwood manifold, with an M112 (and 2 massive turbos ). 7 cores and not a cheap setup by any means.....still, if you want the best you have to pay eh

 

[striker]

he Justin!

M. is the guy that sent me the alloy tubes! nice fella, and sure knows what he's doing.

still can't believe that so many are now using this, when I opted for it 4 years ago everybody was very very skeptical.

goes to show: that all presure loss that is measurable, can be calculated right back to isentropic (de)expansion. so the cores realy work as good as laminova says they do,
mine should be even better that Matt's ones,(by very little probably) because he welds the tubes together lenghtwise and then needs to hone them in order to get the cores in, the gap inbetween the cores in mine is spot on over the complete length.

consider this, my complete intercooler measures 190mm x 400mm x 70mm
and will flow 892Cubic meters an hour rougly enough to support well over 600hp and can do that with a presure los below 4.9KPA, simply put there simply is no radiator type intercooler that can achieve that, and allways has the problem of containing a lot of compresible charge.

anyway that LS 12 core one is Overkill beyond all reason.

grtz Thomas

 

[JustenGT8]

I'm a believer....even if the physics is still a bit much for an intuitive thinker

So how far off do you think you are from a running engine?

 

[striker]

Hey Justin,

Lots still to do, the engine intake system is by far the biggest challenge,
when the IC mani is completed these are the things still to do.

Make flanges for the SC intake
Make flange and Y pipe for the TB(s)
Make flange and piping vor the BPV(s)

Buy and connect Omex 710 ECU

Build crossover exhaust system (if fits, otherwise bank to collector x 2)

Get adaptorplate flywheel clutch build in UK and fit
find suitable starter of porsche

when that's done basicly the engine can be run, and since I also ordered the custon GKN driveshafts at GD basicly that would mean that when I connect the fuel pump en other wet systems, I can drive it around the block. but that would mean the whole car has have to be build allready....

perhaps the engine will go on the dyno seperate (ie out of car) in which case, the question can be anwserd Quick! when the omex gets here within 2 months if all goes to plan that is.

grtz Thomas

 

[JustenGT8]

Hmmm quite a 'to do' list you have there Thomas

A few little tweaks currently in progress on the Celica but hopefully all doable before our next track day in March

 

[nz jailbar]

just a thought about starter motor,have a think about subaru one as they have plenty off power and will fit in buy gearbox and spin the rite way.

 

[MattMc]

Hi Tom

If we feed out vertically we come in around 438mm with these kind of end plates and only requiring one O-Ring to seal. We can reduce this too if required a little.

 

[MattMc]

mine should be even better that Matt's ones,(by very little probably)

anyway that LS 12 core one is Overkill beyond all reason.

grtz Thomas

I learnt a lot for the first one as did you. Is yours better hmmm I reckon they are as good as each other.

As for the 12 core LS1's here are making over 1800hp but they are dyno queens.

Keep up the good work, a close friend of mine here has just bought a kit and a 20v silver top for it, similar to the one you sold but a different make,

The new one looks nice though.

Regards Matt

 

[JustenGT8]

Which Gardner Douglas chassi then Thomas?

 

[striker]

Gardner douglas T70 round tube chassis,
aka the mother of all spaceframe chassis, i've seen an Ultima GTR chassis (not bad as you know as it holds several world records) next to a GD T70 chassis at the factory and boy does the GTR chassis look flimsy compared to the GD thing.

here's a few piccies of the chassis build up at the factory, note not all trianglulation is in at the point :wtf:
Another difference is that you can opt for dual rollbars that sounds strange but when you see it it makes sence, i dont have a piccie of that, I ordered the dual version.

and the finnished product

so basicly..... That's going to be nice!

give me some optuion on colour btw I cannot decide, the chassis will be powdercoated silver-grey

Grtz thomas