Project Thread Project SC400TT

[JBrady]

Believe it or not this was covered in Corky Bells book...
Yep some seem to get away with cooling issues ..

Like I preach to my Mrs & kids...
Overheating is far far worse than running out of petrol !!!

I actually worked for Corky back in 1989-1990 and he described the importance of ducting to me while he was evaluating a top speed RX7 in the shop with a horizontal mount intercooler (parallel to the road)(one of the few packaging options). I was also able to read some of the chapters of Maximum Boost as he was writing it. Lots of knowlege there but the world of boosting has gone a long ways since then and there are some really talented builders and tuners (along with many more "less" talented)

Ryan, re-install the front under cover, fit foam between the side edges of the intercooler to a/c core and from a/c to radiator. You want the ONLY option for the air to flow is through the cores and possibly into the turbo inlets if you have plumbed cold air induction (almost always a good plan). This combined with your new fans and removed "blockage" will probably be enough for moderate street duty depending on how much power you make and how long you make it for.

Oh and make sure you do not have the same problem as BlackUZZ31

 

[SC400TT]

I actually worked for Corky back in 1989-1990 and he described the importance of ducting to me while he was evaluating a top speed RX7 in the shop with a horizontal mount intercooler (parallel to the road)(one of the few packaging options). I was also able to read some of the chapters of Maximum Boost as he was writing it. Lots of knowlege there but the world of boosting has gone a long ways since then and there are some really talented builders and tuners (along with many more "less" talented)

Ryan, re-install the front under cover, fit foam between the side edges of the intercooler to a/c core and from a/c to radiator. You want the ONLY option for the air to flow is through the cores and possibly into the turbo inlets if you have plumbed cold air induction (almost always a good plan). This combined with your new fans and removed "blockage" will probably be enough for moderate street duty depending on how much power you make and how long you make it for.

Oh and make sure you do not have the same problem as BlackUZZ31

John,

Got it. WHo is blackuzz31?

Ryan

 

[XR8tt]

I have found fans on front pushing seem to restrict at higher speeds ...
Yes Corkey book is well getting old now esp when it comes to ECU's and different methods of tuning...
I mainly mentioned as describing things in print from my head through fingers is NOT that easy to explain...Lol..
AS they say a picture is worth a 1000 words...!!
Hoping most on here has his book as a starting point...

 

[BlackUZZ31]

John,

Got it. WHo is blackuzz31?

Ryan

Ohhh the indignity

 

[cribbj]

John,

Got it. WHo is blackuzz31?

Ryan

Ryan, I think John's referring to this little issue: http://www.lextreme.com/forums/showpost.php?p=118682&postcount=793

 

[JBrady]

I have found fans on front pushing seem to restrict at higher speeds ...
Yes Corkey book is well getting old now esp when it comes to ECU's and different methods of tuning...
I mainly mentioned as describing things in print from my head through fingers is NOT that easy to explain...Lol..
AS they say a picture is worth a 1000 words...!!
Hoping most on here has his book as a starting point...

I agree that the front mount fan is likely to hurt cooling at speed. It may be needed for low speed heat dissipation for an aggressively driven "street" car. Have to admit that even though I read parts of it during its writing... I do not personally have a copy! Should probably pick one up just because.

Ryan, I think John's referring to this little issue: http://www.lextreme.com/forums/showpost.php?p=118682&postcount=793

Exactly.

Ohhh the indignity

The price of lurking

In all seriousness our longtime lurking now posting friend Mr. BlackUZZ31 is an excellent new resource for this site.

http://www.lextreme.com/forums/showthread.php?p=118668#post118668

Here is one of his vehicles that fits nicely with this thread.

 

[SC400TT]

Ohhh the indignity

Don't worry about it...You fit in perfectly with this crowd...

Ryan, I think John's referring to this little issue: http://www.lextreme.com/forums/showpost.php?p=118682&postcount=793

I see now...

I agree that the front mount fan is likely to hurt cooling at speed. It may be needed for low speed heat dissipation for an aggressively driven "street" car. Have to admit that even though I read parts of it during its writing... I do not personally have a copy! Should probably pick one up just because.




Exactly.



The price of lurking

In all seriousness our longtime lurking now posting friend Mr. BlackUZZ31 is an excellent new resource for this site.

http://www.lextreme.com/forums/showthread.php?p=118668#post118668

Here is one of his vehicles that fits nicely with this thread.

I read that post...Quite funny...Oh the funny things we do sometimes...

Ryan

 

[XR8tt]

These work well if they fit..
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-G4852/
The Fans in Ford Taurus pump lots of air for cheap second hand fan ..

 

[One Hot]

Ryan I'm running a Megan radiator and FAL 410 model E-fan, so far no overheating issues. We'll see how it holds up during the summer months coming. Although, I have to admit it does get ridiculously hot under the hood. Especially after you do a few hard pulls, but no overheating issues yet.

 

[One Hot]

Yep just test drove the car around town pretty hard. No issues with overheating, but the engine bay is a bit on the hot side. Outside temp is a cool 65 degrees. The fan however, draws a lot of power from the alternator. Good thing I upgraded to a 200A, but still can't run the radio system loud when driving hard.

 

[cribbj]

Ryan I'm running a Megan radiator and FAL 410 model E-fan, so far no overheating issues. We'll see how it holds up during the summer months coming. Although, I have to admit it does get ridiculously hot under the hood. Especially after you do a few hard pulls, but no overheating issues yet.

Hot, how about some more information about your setup, ie have you twinturboed your motor as Ryan did? It might be apples & oranges trying to compare your setup to Ryan's. Also your ambient temps in NY aren't anywhere near what Ryan is trying to cope with down in FL.

 

[XR8tt]

Is there any ceramic coating on hot side & shields in hot or delicate area's ??
I find you get a little heat sink on engine surrounds...
Which can make heat seem worse than it really is...

 

[stevechumo]

It seems your engine bay is tight, so I'm not sure if you can fit bigger fans in there. It's better to have a skinny OEM radiator with bigger fans than having thick radiator with small fans. If the fans can't move heat out quick enough, the heat is still there.

Since this is trial and error, as with all of us, you may test it by putting bigger fans in there with OEM radiator to see if it'll help.

 

[One Hot]

Hot, how about some more information about your setup, ie have you twinturboed your motor as Ryan did? It might be apples & oranges trying to compare your setup to Ryan's. Also your ambient temps in NY aren't anywhere near what Ryan is trying to cope with down in FL.

Hi there;

I have Ryans old TT setup on my car, running low boost 8-9PSI. As expected, there were a lot of issues with the kit that needed to be sorted out, but I think I got it running good now. I originally brought a FAL 210 it was doing a decent job but the fan motors seized and the excess heat melted the fins as bit so I upgraded to FAL 410. Drove it around last night, the 410 pushes a good amount of air on hard street driving. I do have a Flex a lite variable speed electronic fan controller which I purchased for $100 dollars on Summit racing. http://www.flex-a-lite.com/auto/html/vsc.html

I also have twin Garrett turbo blankets with wrapped downpipe, the headers and DP were coated on both sides originally done by Ryan.

 

[XR8tt]

Hmm ?? Maybe another radiator like an oil cooler [or both, oil & coolant ?] as
extra out of the way cooler ??
The extra expansion may require a larger header tank also..

 

[spf_lexus]

This is a minor detail but adding a bottle of water wetter and pure distilled water will drop some degrees off your system.

 

[SC400TT]

These work well if they fit..
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-G4852/
The Fans in Ford Taurus pump lots of air for cheap second hand fan ..

I know about the Taurus fans, but not for this set up...Thanks for the link...Too thick for my set up.

Ryan I'm running a Megan radiator and FAL 410 model E-fan, so far no overheating issues. We'll see how it holds up during the summer months coming. Although, I have to admit it does get ridiculously hot under the hood. Especially after you do a few hard pulls, but no overheating issues yet.

Glad to see you have it on the road...It should feel pretty good at 8 lbs. That set up is a little smaller, and the DP does not cross over each other like my new set up, so you have more space for fans than I do...

Yep just test drove the car around town pretty hard. No issues with overheating, but the engine bay is a bit on the hot side. Outside temp is a cool 65 degrees. The fan however, draws a lot of power from the alternator. Good thing I upgraded to a 200A, but still can't run the radio system loud when driving hard.

Where did you get a 200 amp alternator???

Hot, how about some more information about your setup, ie have you twinturboed your motor as Ryan did? It might be apples & oranges trying to compare your setup to Ryan's. Also your ambient temps in NY aren't anywhere near what Ryan is trying to cope with down in FL.

IT is similar, as he has my oiriginal TT set up John...

Is there any ceramic coating on hot side & shields in hot or delicate area's ??
I find you get a little heat sink on engine surrounds...
Which can make heat seem worse than it really is...

SS tubing, double ceramic coating, wrapped in DEI Titanium heat wrap.

It seems your engine bay is tight, so I'm not sure if you can fit bigger fans in there. It's better to have a skinny OEM radiator with bigger fans than having thick radiator with small fans. If the fans can't move heat out quick enough, the heat is still there.

Since this is trial and error, as with all of us, you may test it by putting bigger fans in there with OEM radiator to see if it'll help.

Yes Steve, my engine bay is extremely tight...I cannot fit thicker fans...Interesting you brought up a thinnier radiator, as I spoke recently with C&R radiator about my issues, and we discussed that I may actually need a thinner radiator to move the air more quickly through the radiator...We also discussed a better core...

Hi there;

I have Ryans old TT setup on my car, running low boost 8-9PSI. As expected, there were a lot of issues with the kit that needed to be sorted out, but I think I got it running good now. I originally brought a FAL 210 it was doing a decent job but the fan motors seized and the excess heat melted the fins as bit so I upgraded to FAL 410. Drove it around last night, the 410 pushes a good amount of air on hard street driving. I do have a Flex a lite variable speed electronic fan controller which I purchased for $100 dollars on Summit racing. http://www.flex-a-lite.com/auto/html/vsc.html

I also have twin Garrett turbo blankets with wrapped downpipe, the headers and DP were coated on both sides originally done by Ryan.

Gotta add Turbo blankets...Gonna add the DEI Titanium ones to match everything else.

Hmm ?? Maybe another radiator like an oil cooler [or both, oil & coolant ?] as
extra out of the way cooler ??
The extra expansion may require a larger header tank also..

Yes, I am exploring this with C&R...

This is a minor detail but adding a bottle of water wetter and pure distilled water will drop some degrees off your system.

Looked into that too, but will make that a last resort...

Great movement on this thread...I appreciate all of your comments and suggestions...This not only benefits me, but all on this forum since we all are focusing on the Lexus/Toyota V8's.

Thanks,

Ryan

 

[JustenGT8]

definitely use water wetter....i use this on mine and made a major difference at the track for extended periods of boosting.

You still need to find the root issue and have a car that runs to temp normally, but once sorted still use water wetter.

 

[XR8tt]

Check into tuning..???
Rich and or retarded ignition can increase hot side exhaust big time...

The new Camaro spent many days out in Aussie hot desert to check air flow through
radiator etc..
A slight change in design made temps drop .. They pulled a trailer with it's tail gate
up 5 mtrs to add load in 100*F plus conditions..

 

[JBrady]

I was going to suggest adding an auxillary radiator like XR8tt has. Cores come in countless sizes and shapes. One could be fit in a number of ways.

My next thought was a pusher fan mounted parallel to the road with a flap that would push UP and seal to a fabricated duct. The main duct would be like I posted already with the floor being the flap. Low speed, fan on, duct up and sealed creating a pressurized flow from under the car. At speed, fan off, flap drops and seals the pressure from the forward motion flow. Creates a pusher fan without creating any blockage at speed.

This morning thought of another way to "tackle" the problem. Build a shroud that uses the existing available space but then extends out and down (again using available space) leading to a parallel to the road PULLER fan(s). This would gain the needed plenum space between the core and the fans. This shrould should utilize blow out flaps so that forward motion flow would be able to exceed the fan outlet space as needed.

One of the concerns I had about enlarging the exhaust port area on your ported heads was that it would increase the surface area in the port thus increasing the transfer of exhaust port heat to the water jacket in the heads. It also slows the speed giving more time for transfer. The reduction in metal mass is hard to predict if that would be a net increase or not.

Ditto on XR8tt's tuning recommendation as too much retard will really increase exhaust temps as will too rich or combination.

Congrats to One Hot for getting Ryan's original system up and running. Hope he keeps everyone posted on its progress. Will be interesting to compare the two systems outputs as well...