5.8 Liter 500 bhp Lexus (N/A)?

[KazeSupra]

That's some good news right there. The other stuff I hear on the SR forums is that crazy large overbores even with sleeves, is not good for forced induction. It's a much better idea to run a smaller bore and perhaps a larger stroke in those cases.

This might not be pertinent information, but I read about rod length comparison on Honda engines. Identical B18's were built, one with long rods (1.75ish) and one with short rods (1.5ish). Everything else remained the same. On the dyno, the short rod engine made more power over the entire RPM range and had more peak power.

Hmm...very interesting...

 

[KazeSupra]

That's some good news right there. The other stuff I hear on the SR forums is that crazy large overbores even with sleeves, is not good for forced induction. It's a much better idea to run a smaller bore and perhaps a larger stroke in those cases.

This might not be pertinent information, but I read about rod length comparison on Honda engines. Identical B18's were built, one with long rods (1.75ish) and one with short rods (1.5ish). Everything else remained the same. On the dyno, the short rod engine made more power over the entire RPM range and had more peak power.

Now that I'm thinking correctly, that could be attributed by the fact that, when made from the same materials, the long rod simply has more mass to it. Shorter Rod = less mass to move = more freed up horsepower. I doubt the power difference was great, but possibly still noticeable. Not only that, the engine will rev faster as well.

The problem with this is that when RPMs increase, there is more load on the rod bearings and rods with the shorter ones due to the angle of the rod during the stroke. If you're looking for a higher revving engine, longer rods are your better bet.

What we really need for 6 liters is for someone to make something like Kakimoto Racing or OS Giken did for the RB26. They basically made a deck spacer with already pressed in liners. It increased the deck height 25mm (20mm for the kakimoto version) to allow for a longer stroke and a longer rod. This allowed for the RB26DETT to come to 3.0L (basically 73.7mm to 86mm stroke) and still rev to 9000 (and in some cases, I believe higher than that). If we had 20mm, we could increase the stroke and the rod length as well, and keep the high RPMs as we head to 6 liters. We would need a new intake manifold, or some sort of adaptor to use the stock manifold, but it's restrictive anyway, so no worries.

 

[Anaema]

why would you need an engine that big? i coud understand stroking a 3UZ up to 4.5 or 4.6, but 5.8?! you can already make alot of HP off a small 4L. i havent read the whole discusion yet, but it seems kinda pointless to me. even for a performance engine.

EDIT: and now 6L?! you might as well pull a C6 Corvette's block and have custom made pistons, rods, and crank to take the weight down. then throw a couple of big turbos on there and make 800-900 HP. it would make your life alot easier and you wouldnt have to worry about the block as much.

 

[lowboost]

NA LS1 fully built with 427 bottom end can make 800 bhp without forced induction, but we are talking about 15.1 compression and always C16/110 octane. hahaha, but I would think a 5.3 liter would be the max I would be willing to build a 1uz or 2uz. Personally I am with Anaema, I know the 4.0 liter can make 800hp because the MR8C (SARD/Menicon's V8 Lemans MR2 race car in the mid and late 90's) had the 1uzfe motor modified with custom transmission. was an awesome car.

 

[KazeSupra]

I think it's more to see how much you can do with this wonderful engine. There's not necessarily a need to go any bigger at all. But this is an unexplored world, and some people are trying to get as much out of the engine as they can. Think about it this way: if you can get 6.0L out of the engine, and give it boost, even if it only take 800rwhp, wouldn't it be cool to see the torque curve? Can you imagine a 600rwhp 6.0L 1UZ powered Supra? I can.

To my point, for some people, including myself, it's just why not.

 

[Red Supra]

You wont need a 6L motor for 600rw. A 4 liter will do, even a 3L on 93 octane can do it. Easiest way to get that is a C5 vette and a twin turbo kit from Supercar Tuning Center. 600wrhp and 600rwtq at 14psi. More tire shredding than anyone would ever need. But a vette will never be a supra!

 

[KazeSupra]

You wont need a 6L motor for 600rw. A 4 liter will do, even a 3L on 93 octane can do it. Easiest way to get that is a C5 vette and a twin turbo kit from Supercar Tuning Center. 600wrhp and 600rwtq at 14psi. More tire shredding than anyone would ever need. But a vette will never be a supra!

I actually meant a tuned N/A 100hp/L motor, not a twin turbo. I was using that as an example because we could do it minus the weight of the turbos and piping and get a better weight distribution.

Or, just go all out and do a 6.0L, twin turbo motor with 800rwhp and a monster torque curve...with some slicks, do wheelstands all day.

 

[KazeSupra]

What ever happened to this? I'm starting my 1UZ projects this fall. I wanted to do 1 4.0L version and one that was bored/sleeved/stroked out. I was hoping that this would've been done by now, so that I could get planning done before I start. Update please.

Chris.

 

[Anaema]

I actually meant a tuned N/A 100hp/L motor, not a twin turbo. I was using that as an example because we could do it minus the weight of the turbos and piping and get a better weight distribution.

Or, just go all out and do a 6.0L, twin turbo motor with 800rwhp and a monster torque curve...with some slicks, do wheelstands all day.

youll need alot more HP than 800 to do wheel stands in a front engine car, or atleast alot(and i meean alot) of weight in the back. you can get more than 100HP/L if you tune the car right, mostly get rid of the whole top end.

 

[jibby]

:drive: I say massive bore, massive stroke, massive airforced induction on these 4.0l's IU...all day long..and then pray that the thin cylinder walls don't crack under full boost. Why settle for less when you can have it all.....Don't tease yourself, indulge you only live once......

 

[cowboy bebop]

I am calling today to find out the scoop on the 5.65L stroker crank for the 2uz-fe. : ) No promises, but I've heard good things. Be prepared to spend $$$$..

Eric

 

[KazeSupra]

I am calling today to find out the scoop on the 5.65L stroker crank for the 2uz-fe. : ) No promises, but I've heard good things. Be prepared to spend $$$$..

Eric

Boo! I wanted to do the 1UZ...that doesn't help me.

 

[cowboy bebop]

The 1uz and 2uz cranks are interchangable...

Eric

 

[KazeSupra]

Here's an email I sent to Darton:

"I am interested in the Darton MID Sleeves for the LS1/LS6 (items 600-110 and 600-120). It says that you can bore them up to 4.165”. I was wondering if you could tell me what the max bore on these sleeves would be for a forced induction application. I’m planning on twin turbos, somewhere between 800-900 hp. I was hoping for almost 4.1” for my application, but I wanted to make sure that I could do this without sacrificing too much reliability. Please let me know. Thanks."

Here's the reply:

"Hello,

You can go with a twin turbo between 800-900 hp at a 4.165 bore. The only bore size we don't really recommend going with boost is the 4.200 bore. For that kind of horsepower I would however recommend using the LS-1 block opposed to the LS-6.

Let me know if you have any more questions.

Thanx,"

So the thinness of the bores doesn't make that much difference in the forced induction application...interesting

Chris.

 

[hnknrob]

i dont think anyone else mentioned it, but theres a pretty easy way to get a 5.8 liter toyota v8 that puts out 675 whp. its what they have in the toyota craftsman trucks.

Type: Toyota NASCAR V8
Displacement: 358 Cu.
Power: 675 Horsepower at the Rear Wheel
Induction: Normally Aspirated with 390 cfm Carburetor
Bore: 4.185 Inches
Stroke: 3.250 Inches
Compression Ratio: 12.0:1
Engine Design: Toyota Racing Development, (TRD) U.S.A., Inc.
Fuel: Sunoco Racing Gasoline

and think, once theyre racing in nextel cup in 2007 you should be able to get a 5.8liter with 800plus hp

 

[MikeMan]

i dont think anyone else mentioned it, but theres a pretty easy way to get a 5.8 liter toyota v8 that puts out 675 whp. its what they have in the toyota craftsman trucks.

Type: Toyota NASCAR V8
Displacement: 358 Cu.
Power: 675 Horsepower at the Rear Wheel
Induction: Normally Aspirated with 390 cfm Carburetor
Bore: 4.185 Inches
Stroke: 3.250 Inches
Compression Ratio: 12.0:1
Engine Design: Toyota Racing Development, (TRD) U.S.A., Inc.
Fuel: Sunoco Racing Gasoline

and think, once theyre racing in nextel cup in 2007 you should be able to get a 5.8liter with 800plus hp

Yeah but they are PUSHROD

 

[hnknrob]

*shrugs shoulders*

pushrods dont bother me all that much, i do detest carburators though. but the thread started as a search for a toyota/lexus v8 with 5.8liters and 500 naturally aspirated ponies.

i know if i got the oprtunity to get one of the TRD race engines id be more than willing to plunk it in between an supra or an sc's fenderwells, carburator, pushrods and all.

 

[cowboy bebop]

You have a chance to get your hands on a race crank used by TRD Trucks right now. See above.

Eric

 

[KazeSupra]

Stroker cranks / kits are now available. Visit the Vendor section for more details...

http://lextreme.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4904

Eric

That's freaking awesome...

Except the price! Sheesh. Oh well, I may have to get one anyway.

3.85" Stroke + 99mm bore = 6022 CCs = 6.0L...mmmm...

 

[cowboy bebop]

It's no small cash, but remember that the stroker for the 2jz is $9000.00 usd. The V8 stroker is a bargain compared to that, and it's been throughly tested in race teams for weak points.

Eric