What are the forged rods and piston options out there?

[V8_IS200_marcus]

Just seen this..............

Pankl Connecting Rods

Our sister company, Pankl Engine Systems in Austria, is the world leader for designing and manufacturing extremely high performance rods.
These connecting rods are made from precision die forgings, or also from castings and powder metallurgy formed blanks. Materials primarily used are steel, ultra-high strength steel and a selection of titanium alloys.
Pankl Systems connecting rods are used in:

• High Performance Racing
• High Performance Road Cars
• Special Aircraft
• Exclusive Luxury Vehicles
• High Performance Motorcycles

 

[Zuffen]

E.Solver,

If you don't ask you don't recieve.

Go ahead and ask.

 

[striker]

Pankl........ brrrrr repeat again Pankl.......
that's the guys behind many F1 connecting rods and pistons, High peformance gearboxes and most importantly drive shafts, for ferrari bugatti lamborghnini etc etc,
also they seem to be involved in a LOT of extreme high revving and high power GT1 and 2 series bottom ends.

thing with pankl is that they don't really sell parts, they sell batches off parts which belong together. and not a piston from make A and a rod from make B which will work together but are not made for eachother.
CP makes parts to be bought seperate.
Pankl begun a joined venture with CP in the late 90's iirc

that stuff is normaly not found in street tuned vehicles and very high standard.

a set of high comp pistons 11.5:1 and 9krpm rods would suit me very well. throw in a set of 290+degrees cams, and do the 45mm ITB trick.... hmmm one can dream:sleeping:

if they supervise the rods and pistons in question, your about to get something very special. just look at their piston explination on their website, those have every feature most aftermarket pistons doesn't have.

regards Thomas

 

[morris]

Rod,

So billet is stronger then forged?

Ah so what was the answer here, are the billet rods better than forged?

 

[Zuffen]

With less than 1500hp it won't make any difference.

Probably comes down to price.

 

[LondonBenji]

And if you are gunning for more than 1500bhp? I am guessing forged?

 

[Zuffen]

Forged has the advantage in that the forging process bends the grain of the steel whilst a billet component has the item milled from a block of steel without regard to grain.

That said the difference isn't enough to concern yourself with unless your runing extreme revs or a massive power increase.

Dollar for Dollar billet will suit 99% of people better as they won't explore the limits of the rod.

 

[UTA LS]

I only quickly scanned through this thread so I'm only 75% sure no one mentioned the fact that just about every piston is made by the same foundry. IIRC there's only about 3 foundrys in the world that make forged pistons/rod blanks so its up to he manufacturer of the piston (wiseco, JE, CP, Arias) to change minor specifications such as alloy, dome thickness, gudgeon pin oiling etc... Same thing with connecting rods, the same foundrys make connecting rod blanks that are the machined by companies (manley, eagle, other chineese brand) so if you're trying to compare H beam style rods they're all about the same except for how they specify the shot peening process after final machining. Lastly, I don't recall I've ever seen horsepower break aftermarket forged rods, poor tuning/detonation and RPM kill rods and rod bolts. at 8000 rpm the connecting rod see's about 2500g's of force due to the force of combustion however when the piston is at TDC on the rest stroke the connecting rod yanking it down to the bottom of the bore will see accelerations in excess of 5000g's.

There's a lot of other factors that go into it as mentioned earlier that it really is up to the machinist to follow the directions specified by the manufacturer of the products. But mostly just about every h beam rod and forged piston are extremely similar, and just about identical when it comes to ultimate rod yeild strength. Only differences I can find in rods is in the shot peening process which is only to help aleviate stress cracking due to fatigue over time.

 

[rms]

no one mentioned the fact that just about every piston is made by the same foundry. IIRC there's only about 3 foundrys in the world that make forged pistons/rod blanks

Same thing with connecting rods, the same foundrys make connecting rod blanks that are the machined by companies (manley, eagle, other chineese brand) so if you're trying to compare H beam style rods they're all about the same except for how they specify the shot peening process after final machining.

But mostly just about every h beam rod and forged piston are extremely similar, and just about identical when it comes to ultimate rod yeild strength. Only differences I can find in rods is in the shot peening process which is only to help aleviate stress cracking due to fatigue over time.

Do you mean your world (USA) ? or THE World ?

H beam style rods all about the same ? apart from shot peening ?

Just about identical ultimate rod yield strength ?

Only difference is shot peening process ?

I don't want to be an old grump but I hope you can back all this up with factual data.

 

[UTA LS]

I've only heard all of this from my machinist, I guess he could be full of sh*t but whatever. I'll go ask him again to see if he has any concrete evidence of this, but after looking at pictures most appear very similar if not the same. eagle, manle, scat and even cosworth all appear to be from chinese rod blanks, there are some differences like Pauter, Oliver, Callies and Argo since they all have the capability to manufacture all of these in house on expensive CNC machines. So yes, I mean the world, not just the USA, and as long as the connecting rods are dimensionally the same (as in, if they did come from a single blank manufacturer) they would all be nearly identical in strength, only differences being final machining of big and little ends as well as material differences between batches. Other differences may exist simply because of how rod bolts are threaded or use nuts but that should only effect overall RPM useage and not power holding capability.

 

[Zuffen]

I can state very clearly Argo rods are machined from blank steel (not castings/forgings) here in Australia.

They are made in a sleepy little town west of Newcastle.