Michigan 1UZ - MkIII Supra swap

[milisakeracing]

are you really planning on starting the motor up with no headers at all? dont do that inside or out of the garage. burning stuff is not the problem everyone has delt with a small amount of fire not a big deal, what is a big deal tho is the rush of cold air going back into the motor after each pulse, and colling off the valves whitch will destry them. you know what happens to hot things when they get hit with cold stuff? not good, dont do it.


although if its a motor you dont care about and wanta get youll jolly off by running it with no header its great fun.

if you just ment no exaust system bolted to the header thats fine go for it inside or out. the video in my build thead is open header.

No, it has the exhaust manifolds installed. There would be no way I would have installed the engine without the manifolds on as it would be extremely difficult to install them with the motor in the engine bay and I am not pulling the engine again unless either a) something catastrophic happens or b) I have a different engine to replace it with.

I have the exhaust manifold/cat flanges from Lex and most of my bends plus a y-pipe waiting to be cut and welded but I will be starting the car to make sure it can start and idle before trailering it to the exhaust shop. The two closest items to the exhaust manifold outlets are the ground wire to the transmission and the slave cylinder's rubber line (found out the other day while trying to bleed the master and slave clutch cylinders that they probably have to be replaced...yet another delay/budget altering item, lol).

At the moment sorting this wiring out is keeping me busy.

 

[milisakeracing]

Just a quick update to thank Anodyne, CJSupra90, and Jake for their help so far with the wiring. Although I am still waiting for some further advice from Jake from another question I sent over today, I managed to get the starter subsystem to work today and roll the engine over a few times.

Next up will be the fuel subsystem later today and if it is working before the end of the day, I'll start tackling the ECU and getting the correct voltages/signals to it. Maybe if I am lucky, and with the excellent help and advice from those above, I'll have the car running by this weekend before I leave to fly to NJ for a week on Monday morning.

 

[milisakeracing]

Getting a bit further now. Fuel pump is up and running with the ignition key in the ON position. Starter is still working I even got the check engine light working and had it output the codes today. Good news is I have not found any gas leaks in any of the new connections yet on the new fuel lines. Bad news is two of the power steering fittings I had put on are leaking (may not have tightened enough, they are NPT type JIC fittings) and the car still does not start. I believe the codes currently being output by the ECU may contain the problem:

OBD1 codes:

14
Ignition Signal

15
Ignition Signal

22
ECT Sensor Signal

24
IAT Sensor Signal

41
TP Sensor Signal

47
Sub TP Sensor

Having used the drawing (version 2) from the thread http://lextreme.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4435&highlight=4+pin+ecu that Anodyne pointed me to, I made sure EO1, EO2, E1, and E2 are all grounded. IGN+, NSW, +B, and +B1 are all on switched 12V, the W (Check engine light) is connected through the dash, back to the fuse and switched on with switched power (I think this is obvious since I got the above codes from it, lol), and +BATT is permanently supplied with 12V.

I am going to check the TP sensors tomorrow, it may be possible I mixed the two up when I was reconnecting the harness. Can the two ignitors be swapped around without affecting the system? It may be possible I have their connectors connected in the wrong order as well. The ECT....if this is the automatic transmission, of course it isn't connected. Not sure what is up with the IAT, going to go look this up to see how to diagnose it (part of the MAF?)

Any input would greatly be appreciated.

 

[milisakeracing]

Bad news is two of the power steering fittings I had put on are leaking (may
not have tightened enough, they are NPT type JIC fittings) and the car still
does not start.
> I learned a long time ago, that if a rubber hose is crimped once, then
that part has to be cut off and the next 1 cm crimped next time.

It is actually the fitting and not the compression part. Brand new rubber all the way around on the PS system.

I believe the codes currently being output by the ECU may contain the
problem:

OBD1 codes:

14
Ignition Signal
> off hand not sure what that means, .. but big problem

15
Ignition Signal
> as above


22 ECT Sensor Signal
> Water Temp, vital to get power from engine later, otherwise at the moment
don't worry (FYI: 1uz engines/ECU's limit output if the water temp is too
high/disconnected, there is 20kw+ in having that working properly)

I actually didn't know the ECT was for the water temp, learn something new every day. Is this from the same sensor which goes to the dash or a separate sensor?

24 IAT Sensor Signal
> Intake Air Temp: Mass Air sensors not plugged in /or not wired up right.

I will check the MAF. I may not have seated the connector all the way on. Hopefully the salvage yard didn't mix and match my harness, ECU, and MAF when I ordered them. I do not have the TSRM for this engine, does anyone know what resistances I should see at the MAF?

> (ECT=Engine Coolant Temp) I think that code is in the 84 range, For the
Auto Trans, its called=TCM communication,

Not sure what the IAT is, going to go look this up.
> Air Intake Temperature Sensor; this means that the mass air sensor is not
wired up correctly, the mass air unit has "air volume" and air tempature
sensors inside the same housing (will not effect starting by the way), I
have run and started engines (1uz's) without the mass air sensor even
plugged in.

Excellent information, thanks!

I'd hate patronize you at all but I'm going to go over the basics a bit
here,

The Engine has a crank angle sensor, that tells the ECU, when the crank is
at any one time (that's not "actually" true but lets ignore that), that
signal then tells which ignigter to power and fire which is sent to a dizzy
on the left or right bank, and then according to the dizzys position will
fire a particular cyclinder.

The point being that the firing is "virtually" mechcanical,

Fuel is 100% ECU based,

------------------------------------------------------------------
@@@@ All an engine needs to run, (at a basic level) is fuel, and spark. @@@
------------------------------------------------------------------

No worries about patronizing, there may have been something I missed.

First determine that you have spark by removing a plug and allowing it to
spark against the head while "someone" turns the engine over for you, (FYI
kill the fuel! E.g. no fuel)

IF You have spark on each cylinder, then spray some fuel into the intake and
turn the engine over, if it fires you have a fuel problem. then work out the
fuel problem, that could be that the ECU doesn't understand the engines
being cranked, (**** don't forget to hook STA up !!!) the STA tells the ECU
that the engine is being started, it wont start without it (as far as I
know).

I will do this tonight. The STA is hooked up and getting a voltage signal when the engine is being started. I thought this might have been it but alas it was not the issue.

During starting the ECU does NOT fire the injectors, it fires only the
1000cc cold start injector under the manifold, (fuel dump), that fires the
engine, it catchs runs for 100ms appx, the ECU kicks in, and then runs the
injectors, so you will never see an injector pulse during start up /
starting.

Didn't know this. I'm not sure I even wired the cold start injector, or at least I never touched the wiring for it. When I was cranking the engine, there was no evidence of fuel being pumped out the exhaust manifolds but fuel is definitely circulating in the fuel supply/return lines.

If you have spack, and no fuel, and no other problems, ask yourself why the
cold start injector is not firing.

Read this;
http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/codes/

And this;
http://www.autoelectronico.com/002/tocod001.html

Going to go read these after work. Thanks!

 

[milisakeracing]

Success...sort of!

So yeah it ends up I was not getting spark for some reason and since there was no ignition signal, the ECU would not fire the injectors (no injector 'noise' could be heard).

Good news! Today I started pulling off the covers so I could get at the coil plugs to see if they were sparking and it lit off (guess there was some fuel in the cylinders after all) with a small backfire. Seems that while I was messing around in the wiring I may have somehow put the ECU into 'limp' mode or even overloaded it so it went into protection mode (if such a thing exists).

So I put the coil wire back on the dizzy and was able to get it to kind of start just from the residual fuel in the rails from when I had the pump pressurize the system. I reactivated the fuel pump and she fired right up!! What a wonderful sound. I only ran the engine for ~1 minute since there is no coolant in the system yet, a couple of the PS connectors are leaking (one really losing fluid, nice puddle under it when I turned it off), and the fuel supply line is leaking after all right where I suspected it might so I need to get a different AN adapter for it because the current adapter is a flush adapter and the fuel line on the Supra is flared which means it just isn't sealing against anything. Oil pressure looked real good at close to 90psi on the dash gauge (what a change from the 7M!).

New codes taken today:

22
ECT Sensor Signal - Going to check resistance tomorrow. Wondering if it may not be getting a reading since there is no fluid even in the system yet?

24
IAT Sensor Signal - Checked the MAF connection and it is good, next I'll need to check the resistance here and find out if I am within tolerances or wiring is incorrect.

27
Sub O2S Signal - none installed, only main is installed

29
Sub O2S - none installed, only main is installed

41
TP Sensor Signal - checked connections, reseated, correct connector on correct TP, need to check for voltage/signal and resistance

47
Sub TP Sensor - TRAC is not installed

78
Fuel Pump Control - FPC is not installed

So I need to start working towards eliminating these codes as well as the leaks Plus the rest of the list which consists of wrapping up the cooling system, replacing the master/slave clutch cylinders, getting the exhaust welded up, re-looming some of the wires and getting the ECU bolted into place as a minimum and then working beautification/simplification as time allows Thanks again for the great advice everyone. I am sure I will still have questions moving forward as I get everything put back together and sorting the car out on some trips. As I get things sorted out I will add to the wiring knowledge base for those working on pre-89 chassis swaps.

 

[Peewee]

Sounds like either a lot of sensors are stuffed, unplugged, or the loom has been severely butchered.

Things like the TPS, ECT, IAT are wired directly from the ecu plugs to the sensor plug. And the chances of any of those sensors being stuffed is quite rare (rare, but not impossible).

Unplug each sensor and test for continuity/resistance. Use the 7MGTE TSRM if you don't have access to 1UZ values.
If the sensors check out plug them back in and retest from the ecu plugs (with the ecu plugs unplugged). That will tell you what the ecu is seeing (ie, if the wire is ok - assuming the sensor is)

 

[milisakeracing]

Sounds like either a lot of sensors are stuffed, unplugged, or the loom has been severely butchered.

Things like the TPS, ECT, IAT are wired directly from the ecu plugs to the sensor plug. And the chances of any of those sensors being stuffed is quite rare (rare, but not impossible).

Unplug each sensor and test for continuity/resistance. Use the 7MGTE TSRM if you don't have access to 1UZ values.
If the sensors check out plug them back in and retest from the ecu plugs (with the ecu plugs unplugged). That will tell you what the ecu is seeing (ie, if the wire is ok - assuming the sensor is)

Thanks Peewee. It appears to have been a lack of grounding. When I pulled each of the installed sensors (ECT, IAT, TPS, and sub-TPS) to check wiring, they all had one thing in common (or not so common depending on how you look at it.....), the lack of ground (brown wire on each of the 4 sensors). These sensors' grounds eventually either lead to E2 on the ECU or on the right hand rear head ground. I know before I hacked the wire harness, E2 was not getting ground so I may have either not connected the harness to the head correctly or just not connected it at all at that point. E2 and the sensors now have a shared ground back through E1 if I recall correctly.

I'm in NJ this week otherwise I'd be out there fixing the leaks and filling the cooling system so I can start it back up again and let it run a bit longer. I'll be putting some work in on it this weekend when I get back into town. Not only fixing the leaks but cleaning up the wiring a little so I can get it loomed and tied up out of the way....maybe even put the glove box back in if I can figure out where to route all those bundles of wires.

 

[Peewee]

A faulty ground is what first came to mind, but all the grounds are connected within the factory loom and continue to the ecu, so as long as the starter motor works the sensors will.
However if the E2 pin is not earth correctly, **** will happen.

 

[milisakeracing]

Good news is all diagnostic codes except for the sub-O2 sensors have now been solved. Bad news is the PS pump is leaking, the fuel gauge is not reading (although there may not be enough gas in the tank, we’ll have to wait and see when I finally make it to a gas station) and the coolant sensor for the dash gauge is not reading correctly. For now, enjoy this short video of the Supra happily burbling at idle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uonu_BmB4oI

 

[cjsupra90]

Good news is all diagnostic codes except for the sub-O2 sensors have now been solved. Bad news is the PS pump is leaking, the fuel gauge is not reading (although there may not be enough gas in the tank, we’ll have to wait and see when I finally make it to a gas station) and the coolant sensor for the dash gauge is not reading correctly. For now, enjoy this short video of the Supra happily burbling at idle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uonu_BmB4oI

Just remove the access cover in the hatch, take the sender out of the tank, turn the key on and lift the float arm up and see if the gauge comes up.

 

[cjsupra90]

Good news is all diagnostic codes except for the sub-O2 sensors have now been solved. Bad news is the PS pump is leaking, the fuel gauge is not reading (although there may not be enough gas in the tank, we’ll have to wait and see when I finally make it to a gas station) and the coolant sensor for the dash gauge is not reading correctly. For now, enjoy this short video of the Supra happily burbling at idle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uonu_BmB4oI

When you say coolant sensor for the dash gauge, are you meaning the Temp Gauge or the coolant level indicator?

If you are refering to the temp guage, you did reuse the supra sensor sensor right and not the Lexus one that probably came with the motor? If you happened to use the lexus one, swap it for the supra one cause the lexus one is just a switch, not a veriable resistor like the supra one.

 

[milisakeracing]

When you say coolant sensor for the dash gauge, are you meaning the Temp Gauge or the coolant level indicator?

If you are refering to the temp guage, you did reuse the supra sensor sensor right and not the Lexus one that probably came with the motor? If you happened to use the lexus one, swap it for the supra one cause the lexus one is just a switch, not a veriable resistor like the supra one.

Yup, forgot to do this. I'll swap them tomorrow. As for the fuel sender, it wouldn't surprise me if it were working correctly, I did put the car into storage nearly empty and with all of the starting and pumping some of the fuel out after deburring the fuel line to make sure I didn't have metal shavings in the line it really could be empty, lol.

 

[Peewee]

Temp guage sensor on the 1UZ is identical to the one in your Supra.

(we are talking about the single wire one located just behind the upper coil).

 

[milisakeracing]

Temp guage sensor on the 1UZ is identical to the one in your Supra.

(we are talking about the single wire one located just behind the upper coil).

That's the one we're talking about. I know I have the correct wire connected since as soon as I disconnect it the gauge drops to zero but while connected it goes straight past the hot zone and pegs at the top. When I pulled the bolt/plug there at the thermostat housing I could stick my finger in the water and although it was warm, was not enough to burn (same at the radiator cap as well). Burped the system in case of air and it still registers the same. Going to swap the sensor just in case, have the spare here anyway. I don't think it matters but I'll mention it anyway, I also have the heater outlets connected together instead of running them to the heater core.

 

[Peewee]

May as well swap the sensor as it could well be faulty.

 

[milisakeracing]

Temp guage sensor on the 1UZ is identical to the one in your Supra.

(we are talking about the single wire one located just behind the upper coil).

Finally got around to taking out both sensors as well as doing some investigative work in trying to cross reference the specs of each sending unit in the two cars. Using Standard's catalog I was able to come up with the following information pictured below. As one will observe, these units are not only incompatible due to size but also due to the resistance specifications.

The temperature sending units did not become the same unit until approximately the 1994 Toyota Supra 2JZ-GTE (the 2JZ-GE is an entirely different unit compared to all of them even from the previous 7M series) and the 1993 Lexus SC400 1UZ-FE at which time the unit is similar in size and appearance to the Lexus unit pictured but with a different type of connector (although still 1-wire). The only other time at which they were the same was for the 1990 Supra 7M-GE (86-89 and 91-92, all 7M series motors used the same sending unit, only '90 differed) at which time the same unit as the one pictured for the Lexus was used so possibly the dash gauge was calibrated differently for that particular year/model.

There is only one error in the photo which are the years for the Lexus. It should be '90-92 LS400 and '92 SC400.

 

[cjsupra90]

Mike, looking at the info that you found out, the lexus one should work, just not accurately. Your problem sounds like the sensor itself is bad. Basically, as the coolent starts to warm up, it sensor shorts to ground creating vertuially a 0 ohm condition and therefor pegging the gauge.

If the lexus one was working correctly, it should read a tad higher on the gauge then the supra one at the same temp. You might not even see a differance being that the temp to ohm's scale is not a liner progression (basically it's almost flat lining at hight temps....) I've watched my supra with good sensor go from 185*F to 245*F on an autometer mechanical guage and yet the factory gauge barely moved (and my EMS matched the autometer so being that two different measuring devices showed the exact same change, Im pretty sure that it was accurate.)

 

[milisakeracing]

Mike, looking at the info that you found out, the lexus one should work, just not accurately. Your problem sounds like the sensor itself is bad. Basically, as the coolent starts to warm up, it sensor shorts to ground creating vertuially a 0 ohm condition and therefor pegging the gauge.

If the lexus one was working correctly, it should read a tad higher on the gauge then the supra one at the same temp. You might not even see a differance being that the temp to ohm's scale is not a liner progression (basically it's almost flat lining at hight temps....) I've watched my supra with good sensor go from 185*F to 245*F on an autometer mechanical guage and yet the factory gauge barely moved (and my EMS matched the autometer so being that two different measuring devices showed the exact same change, Im pretty sure that it was accurate.)

After some testing today I agree with your comments Chris. As sheepish as it may sound, I think it may be a grounding issue. I purchased an Autometer gauge and sensor today with the hopes of just replacing the 1UZ sensor with the Autometer sensor since they're both 1/8" NPT. However, the Autometer sensor, even though 1/8" NPT has a sensor body that is slightly larger than the hole it needs to slip through, grr!

So anyway, I put it in one of the adapters it came with and laid it in the plug hole at the thermostat housing, wired up the 12V and ground along with the sensor wire and started the car. Once the car read red hot on the internal gauge, the Autometer was only reading 125-150F. I remove the ground to the Autometer and it shoots up to 210F. Hmm says I. I take the Supra sending unit and lay it in the plug hole, attach the wiring harness to it and the internal gauge reads red hot still. Now I believe it may be a grounding problem on the body harness since I have ground at the water neck (via check with the continuity meter to the ground terminal at the battery). It seems I may be pulling the dash apart tomorrow if I cannot figure out where the ground for the dash gauge is at on the harness.

It may be possible to use the 1UZ sending unit after all although it'll read off a bit on the low end due to the difference in resistance at 100F it should be almost the same at the upper end. Still waiting to find out if the TS-319 sending unit (Standard Motors, SMP, number) on the later 1UZ starting in '93 and the in the 2JZ-GTE in '94 has a closer match to the resistance range or not. The parts store didn't have it in their specs like the other two so I'll need to call SMP on Monday.

For now it is back to wire chasing, not only for the temp sending unit but for the blinkers as well. All other lights are working, but not the blinkers....not that anyone around here still uses them anyways, I still like to

 

[milisakeracing]

I finished the wiring of the 1UZ temperature sensor as well as the e-fan today. Just need to verify the temperature is within a safe operating range once the gauge indicates the system is at operating temps.

I also wrapped up looming all of the remaining loose wires in the engine bay today and installed the 7M-GE throttle cable. Tomorrow I plan on wrapping up the interior wiring, hopefully mounting the 1UZ ECU in the original location of the 7M ECU, and installing the hood. I still need to get a new air filter and box in the frame work around it along with fixing the PS pump leak and getting a battery tie down on the battery. I'll also need to figure out why the ABS is throwing a code now (haven't gone through the diagnostics yet on it). I also have an occasional stumble at idle after warm-up which could be either a vacuum leak or the fuel pump may be going bad (noted a miss in the fuel pump during testing today, will have to monitor the fuel pressure).

 

[milisakeracing]

Nearly complete

This weekend was an eventful one. The engine bay wiring was completed and loomed, the e-fan was tested although the temperature still needs to be independently verified, the Spectre 3" MAF adapter was installed, and the hood was re-attached.

The front interior was also reassembled today. All loose wires in the wiring harness were capped and zipped tied up out of the way, the center surround was reinstalled and the blinkers and radio tested, the ECU and harness were placed in the glove box as a temporary home and the glove box and lower interior piece were reinstalled. The front interior just needs a good vacuuming now to suck up the bits of wire and insulation left over from the installation.

The hatch interior pieces will be reassembled after I run new speaker connections to bypass the stock speaker locations. I plan on running the 6.5" fronts and installing one or two small subwoofers in the rear for low-end filler. However this will be done at a much later date as it does not affect the current project nor would it delay putting the car on the road.

At this point the only thing left to do to put the car on the road is to take it to the exhaust shop to get the exhaust fabbed up. This will most likely happen sometime during the next couple of weeks and I am shooting to have the car on the road by August 17 or 18, although it will really depend on how backlogged the exhaust shop is with work. Once the car is on the road the sorting/on-road testing will be started at which time I plan on driving it as a daily driver on short runs around town and slowly extending those drives out to cross-state trips until I am satisfied the car is ready for longer drives such as to Chicago or St. Louis.

While I wait on the exhaust to be fabricated I will be updating/creating and publishing the project parts list with prices and vendors as well as producing a wiring guide for the '87 Toyota Supra since some wires are slightly different than those found on the '89+ although most differences are just connector differences there are some small gotchas hidden in there. Just a remind that this was not a full conversion as the A/C and heat abilities were not kept. The A/C equipment in the engine bay and on the engine were removed and the heater hoses were looped at the engine. This car is never driven in the winter, although heat may be added at a later date for those cold days which bracket the salt season here in Michigan.