Newbie in Supercharging a SC400

[stevechumo]

Hello V8 lovers,
I'm a newbie both in supercharging and SC400 engine even though I've been building turbo systems on Honda engines for quite awhile. I'm wondering how I can put an Eaton M90 in place of the intake manifold for the SC400. As I see in the picture, there're 3 things that I don't know what to do once I fabricate the manifold as the base for the Eaton supercharger. First, in front of the intake manifold, which is also in front of the "L" logo and right behind the plastic cover that says "1UZ-FE", there's a device that is black and round shape, which is connected to the intake tube on the left by a 3/4 inch hose. Second, a little further back to the right of the "L" logo, there's a device that's attached to the right of the intake manifold that has a white base and a black device on top of it. Third is the 5/8" hose on the very end of intake manifold that is positioned closed to the firewall. In general, I don't know what to do with most things that are attached to the intake manifold, because once I build the manifold for the Eaton M90, they have to be put somewhere and I don't know what to do with them.

Your inputs are greatly appreciated.

 

[Zuffen]

The front device is the ICV (idle control valve) it maintains idle speed when you turn the steering wheel or the air cuts.

The second (white base black top) looks like part of the EGR system. We don't run EGR in Australia so that's an educated guess.

The 5/8 hose will also be part of the EGR.

 

[stevechumo]

The front device is the ICV (idle control valve) it maintains idle speed when you turn the steering wheel or the air cuts.

The second (white base black top) looks like part of the EGR system. We don't run EGR in Australia so that's an educated guess.

The 5/8 hose will also be part of the EGR.

Thanks for your input. So what should I do with the Idle Control Valve and the EGR? I never opened up the SC intake manifold so I don't know about its structure. Should I attach these devices to the fabricated supercharger manifold by cutting holes and bolt them up? As I saw several SC400 supercharger systems on www.planetsoarer.com or other systems, I didn't see where these devices go such as this one.

 

[Lextreme II]

EGR u can delete. We have a kit for that www.lextreme.com/allgo.html and ICV, i am still scratching my head.

 

[Peewee]

You can ditch the ISCV, your idle just won't be as nice.
You just have to open the throttle plate a teeny bit more, and then readjust the TPS so that it is still in IDL.

Cold idle probably won't be fantastic, but warm idle should be fine.

 

[stevechumo]

EGR u can delete. We have a kit for that www.lextreme.com/allgo.html and ICV, i am still scratching my head.

Your EGR kit looks good, but I'm wondering if the car can still pass the smog test without the EGR. I know that custom supercharging isn't smog legal in California, but well, some smog testers don't care what I have in the car unless the car fails the test.

 

[stevechumo]

You can ditch the ISCV, your idle just won't be as nice.
You just have to open the throttle plate a teeny bit more, and then readjust the TPS so that it is still in IDL.

Cold idle probably won't be fantastic, but warm idle should be fine.

Do you think that instead of ditching the Idle Control Valve, I could cut a hole in the supercharged manifold or plenum and bolt the ICV onto it? Is there any special instruction?

 

[Peewee]

Thats a much better idea, but it would have to be after the throttle body, but before the compressor in my opinion.

 

[quadcam boat]

You should be able to reconnect everything back on. You just need to relocate them between the throttle body and the supercharger inlet.

 

[stevechumo]

Supercharging V8 SC400

As you're saying about relocating the Idle Control Valve and the EGR, did you mean that these devices have to be installed on the section of "air chamber" after the throtle body and before the supercharger itself? Are they to be put in the same section as the blow off valve? In this section, do I need to create several male tubes for vacuum? Once these devices are installed, are there any further adjustments to them or just leave them as is? Thanks.

Bests,
Steve

 

[quadcam boat]

Yeah,
after the throttle body but before the supercharger. That way the accessories you are relocating will have vacuum at idol and atmospheric pressure at wide open throttle (which would be full boost into the engine). This would be the same situation as before you fit the supercharger - vacuum at idol and atmospheric pressure at WOT for these accessories.
It would be a good idea to refit the idol control as it is a great thing. Things like the crankcase breather can be deleted and replaced with an oil catch can, which has some advantages, but may give you some dramas for a roadworthy certificate of emissions testing.

You would put your blow off valve after the supercharger and before the air enters the engine (of course!!), but I'm not sure why you would want to fit a blow off valve??
To regulate the boost pressure on a positive displacement supercharger, just change the pulley sizes untill you get the boost you want. You don't need a blow off valve.

I'm not a turbo freak, buit I think they are intended for turbo setups to allow excess boost to vent as you back off the throttle (especially during gear changes). By venting the excess air, the turbo dosen't loose it's rotational speed and is spinning fast enough to have boost come on quicker when you plant your foot again after changing gears.

I have heard of some people have used them on cyntrifugal supercharger setups so they can run a higher drive ratio and bring on boost in the lower RPM range.
At higher RPM, the high drive ratio creates too much boost, so the blow off valve vents excess pressure to regulate the boost to a level that the engine can handle.

A bit of a waste really, because the supercharger is drawing excess power to make the boost and then it is being wasted as the excess boost is being bled off anyway. This is the tradeoff to get a cyntrifugal to create boost in the lower RPM range.

The only other reason to fit a blow off valve is for 'wank' factor.

 

[quadcam boat]

By the way, you should fit a supercharger bypass valve - not essential though. Have a read of Jordy's supercharger design article if you don't know much about them.
Also, some of the later series Eaton superchargers already have them built in, which is pretty convenient.
Good luck,
Andrew.

 

[MWP]

You can only use a blow off valve if the throttle body is AFTER the compressor.

 

[Lextreme II]

I wonder if the ICV and EGR can be remotely monted.

 

[Zuffen]

The ICV can be. Just use a length of hos to connect it to the intake.

EGR is designed to feed small amounts of burn exhaust gas (I know obviously it's burnt it's exhaust gas, but someone may ask) into the intake as it's beneficial to emissions. Because it needs to be connected to and from the exhaust I can't see any reason/benefit to remote mount it except for appearance.

 

[stevechumo]

By the way, you should fit a supercharger bypass valve - not essential though. Have a read of Jordy's supercharger design article if you don't know much about them.
Also, some of the later series Eaton superchargers already have them built in, which is pretty convenient.
Good luck,
Andrew.

As with high regards to your wonderful info., may I ask if you know any sources that sell the long serpentine belt to fit the supercharger? Secondly, do you know if the Eaton supercharger's pulley has the same ribs as the SC's pulleys? If not, will other aftermarket pulleys fit such as on Ebay? Thanks.

 

[stevechumo]

I wonder if the ICV and EGR can be remotely monted.

You're right. I thought about it, too. But I haven't really parted them, so I really don't know if it's doable due to their related linkages such as hoses, wires, cables..etc. There's one thing that I know is the computer and all sensors are very sensitive in voltage. As I previously wired the SAFC II to the ECU for a turbo system on a Honda, I hastily left just 1/4" core wire outside of the soldered spot between the wires, the ECU threw a code of a TPS. After I cut that 1/4" wire, the code is gone. On this new project, I'm just trying to gather as much info. as you all could share with me. To me, life is a process of learning.

 

[stevechumo]

The ICV can be. Just use a length of hos to connect it to the intake.

EGR is designed to feed small amounts of burn exhaust gas (I know obviously it's burnt it's exhaust gas, but someone may ask) into the intake as it's beneficial to emissions. Because it needs to be connected to and from the exhaust I can't see any reason/benefit to remote mount it except for appearance.

Do you think blocking the EGR will pass smog test or harm the engine? Thanks.

 

[Cobra]

Stevechumo

Depends what Eaton you buy. The blower that I used is of an L67 GM V6. Found in alot of late model American cars. It has a 6 rib pulley which is the same as the Lexus.
Pulleys are interchangeble anyway.
If you run the motor without the ICV you will never get it to run properly. The ecu is dependent on feedback. The car will idle like a pig and adjusting the throttle will not fix it.
You can mount the ICV in the intake plenum between the T/B and Blower it will work perfectly. Check the photo's of my setup in the contest section of this website.

 

[stevechumo]

Stevechumo

Depends what Eaton you buy. The blower that I used is of an L67 GM V6. Found in alot of late model American cars. It has a 6 rib pulley which is the same as the Lexus.
Pulleys are interchangeble anyway.
If you run the motor without the ICV you will never get it to run properly. The ecu is dependent on feedback. The car will idle like a pig and adjusting the throttle will not fix it.
You can mount the ICV in the intake plenum between the T/B and Blower it will work perfectly. Check the photo's of my setup in the contest section of this website.

http://www.lextreme.com/contest.cobra.html

Brett

Wow! The system looks amazing, even with the idea that you positioned the throtle body parallel to the blower and connected them through a pipe. With the throtle body, did you have to adjust its cables or they just have some slacks and fit perfectly? Where did you get the long belt to drive the blower and how did you position it? I couldn't seem to see it from the top. When you mention that the idle will be like a pig without the ICV, it makes me remember of a "slang word" in Vietnamese which calls the porn movie as the "pig movie", which means nude...hah..hah...hah..you're amazing! I guess the engine without the ICV is like the pig movie is missing somethings. Thanks for the info. and the laugh.