1UZ-2UZ Preferance

[suprab808]

I have been reading this site and it has been quite informing. However I am curious on which motor will perform the best.

1UZ
What are its pros and cons? 6bolt mains and lighter block.

2UZ
Same thing Pros and Cons? Iron block and get 4 bolt spayed mains and can be stroked to 5.4L.

Thanks for the info.

Brian

 

[Lextreme II]

In stock form? Mod NA or FI form?

 

[suprab808]

In stock form? Mod NA or FI form?

Sorry I totally brain farted that vital info.

It will be TT with aftermarket rods,pistons.

How fast have either of these engines been spun on a regular basis?? Was there anything special that needed to be done to hit that certain RPM limit?

Goals are around 800-1000hp

 

[Lextreme II]

I wouldn't stroke any motor if I would plan to have high hp. Stick with 1uzfe VVTi and mod the internals.

 

[suprab808]

I wouldn't stroke any motor if I would plan to have high hp. Stick with 1uzfe VVTi and mod the internals.

How is the 4.0L going to take to the Boost and RPMS? I was in the mindset that a 5.XL engine will be able to get the power sooner and more torque.

Why not stroke it? oke:

Thought I would add more thoughts to my post.

So if you take a 4.7L and Make it a 5.4L without making the walls to thin or making the engine way off balance. Get all L19 or 1/2" bolts to seal it all up then what would the problem be? You will spool the same turbos faster and have your HP sooner and would be able to shut down a little sooner in the RPM band thus making your engine less stressful. However this is a computer geeks thoughts!! I am here for the knowledge!!

 

[Zuffen]

I spot a bit of a contradiction.

You want to know how hard these engine can be revved, yet to ask about stroking them.

One of our members has a dyno sheet showing in excess of 9,500rpm!

If you stroke the engine you start restricting the rev limit and you also alter rod/stroke ratio.

If you do stroke the engine you're probably looking at a sensible redline of 6,000rpm.

800 to 1,000FWHP is a big ask.

 

[suprab808]

I spot a bit of a contradiction.

You want to know how hard these engine can be revved, yet to ask about stroking them.

One of our members has a dyno sheet showing in excess of 9,500rpm!

If you stroke the engine you start restricting the rev limit and you also alter rod/stroke ratio.

If you do stroke the engine you're probably looking at a sensible redline of 6,000rpm.

800 to 1,000FWHP is a big ask.

I do not see the contradiction. I asked how fast have you guys spun the engine. If a stock 4.7L has been spun to 9500RPM and this was without any problems then great. Then if you stroke it to 5.4L but reduce the RPM band you might have greater benefits. That is why I asked. Maybe you will get more torque/HP out of the 5.4L and only have to rev to 7K-RPM. I do not know thats why I asked.

The 2JZ on a 3.0 was spun to 9k-9.5RPM to get the large powerband at high HP. Once they made it 3.4L you were able to shut down at 8.5K-RPM safely and get the same HP numbers.

A HP number does not determine your RPM Powerband range when we talk about almost a 1.0L difference.

See what I mean???

 

[cribbj]

Hang on there you're jumping to a few premature conclusions.

The engine Zuffen's referring to wasn't a 4.7l, definitely wasn't stock, and if it's the one I think he's referring to, it had a few longevity problems at that elevated RPM.

We in the UZ hotrodding community aren't nearly as far along the development curve as the 2JZ motor is, and coaxing big numbers out of the UZ's is proving to be a bit more challenging than with the 2JZ.

That's why Zuffen said 800-1000 FWHP is a big ask. No one's been there yet, save the hard core racers, and they're not sharing all their secrets.

It's true the additional 1.0l the 1UZ motor has over the JZ should be an advantage both on the top and bottom ends, but the reality is that it's only been an advantage so far on the bottom end.

Some of us with "built" UZ's have seen the north side of 500 HP, but not much more, and a 2JZ with stock internals can do that without even breathing hard.......

If you're really after big ponies, you're going to spend a lot more on a 1UZ to get them than you'd spend on a 2JZ.

If it's more low end grunt that you're after, you're in the right place.

 

[suprab808]

Hang on there you're jumping to a few premature conclusions.

The engine Zuffen's referring to wasn't a 4.7l, definitely wasn't stock, and if it's the one I think he's referring to, it had a few longevity problems at that elevated RPM.

We in the UZ hotrodding community aren't nearly as far along the development curve as the 2JZ motor is, and coaxing big numbers out of the UZ's is proving to be a bit more challenging than with the 2JZ.

That's why Zuffen said 800-1000 FWHP is a big ask. No one's been there yet, save the hard core racers, and they're not sharing all their secrets.

It's true the additional 1.0l the 1UZ motor has over the JZ should be an advantage both on the top and bottom ends, but the reality is that it's only been an advantage so far on the bottom end.

Some of us with "built" UZ's have seen the north side of 500 HP, but not much more, and a 2JZ with stock internals can do that without even breathing hard.......

If you're really after big ponies, you're going to spend a lot more on a 1UZ to get them than you'd spend on a 2JZ.

If it's more low end grunt that you're after, you're in the right place.

Well I want the best of both worlds. The low end grunt but I want the power to carry on longer than 2.5k RPM. I do not think an engine that is poochy until the last 2.5k of an 8.5k RPM range is very fun. That is why I am looking at more displacement.

I love Toyota's owned 2 JZA80 but have moved on. Going with a 65stang with 9" rear. Almost 1000lbs lighter.

I am just probing for info on pro's and con's. So far I think the 2UZ is the way I will want to go simply for the displacement and Iron block.

Theoretically, if I was to take a 2uz block and equip it with L19 bolts, Carrilo H-Rods (or equivelent) with CARR bolts or ARP, Pistons that can withstand the boost, and instal the 4 bolt splayed mains. All the proper bearings and such.

Is there any faults with the block itself?? Walls thinner than normal? That is what I am looking for. So far all I have seen is the 1UZ has problems with stock threading for main studs and head studs. I have heard that once you tap for beefier threaded studs then the walls become dangerously thin.

I realize not to many people have played with this engine much and I am willing to do some testing myself. I decided to go with the UZ family because as living in Japan these engines are readily available at junkyards and such. Cars get wrecked and taken to a Junk yard. I might buy one and just tear it apart once I get back to look at stuff. hehehe

 

[XR8tt]

Seems 800 h.p from a 1UZ with forged internals is about at its peak..
Keep in mind the extra weight of the 2UZ it will possibly require an extra 200 h.p ?? Keep in mind the 1UZ has the same stroke as the 330 stroked 302 Windsor.. Turbo seem to spool better on long stroke motors..
With GOOD tune, top quality parts etc..Your pony will haul!!!
With top notch tranz to optimize transplant...
For a street car?? I would aim for 600 h.p..
One advantage of a turbo engine is its very easy on rotating assembly and power can be adjustable...
The 1UZ crank seems to be MORE suited to better rpm balance..
With correct turbo's, compression, tune power band should be from 2500 all the way through to 7500 with some help with head porting [CNC ?? ] and better cam, valve springs..
As with any engine..
Whats the price difference between Cobra 4v / 1UZ transplant ..??

 

[cribbj]

Back in the 90's we thought 500 was the magic number for the 2JZ-GTE.

Then someone came up with the idea of replacing the stock twins with a big single, then a bigger single, then a monster single. These days this little 3.0l motor is making 2000 HP, and is running in the 7's in some configurations.

We're doing all the same tricks with the UZ's that we did with the 2JZ, but we're nowhere near unlocking these motors' full potential yet.

 

[spf_lexus]

Well if Toyota keeps it's consistency then I hope a 4.0L can manage 3,000 in extreme trim? That would be so cool to crack into the magical 6 range with a Toyota.

 

[gmacrae]

Well if Toyota keeps it's consistency then I hope a 4.0L can manage 3,000 in extreme trim? That would be so cool to crack into the magical 6 range with a Toyota.

2j's have been doing 6's for quite a while now, 5's cant be too far off. The 1uz isnt a tough enough block to ever catch up to the 2j's. The iron block's might someday but the v8 isnt as perfect for chasing all out power as the straight 6 - even with cubes in its favour. If there were such thing as a 4L JZ engine... wow.

Unfortunately engines like the 2jz dont make much economic sense anymore so we're going to be stuck with engines that are high strung in factory form, and dont take well to bolt on mods (thanks vvt). Its disappointing how many new cars are having serious issues, spun bigends etc

Oops, way off topic now... all i can say to the thread starter is that i've heard the 1uz block physically splits down the centre at around 1500hp, but for anything up to about 1000 hp i'd stick with the alloy engine, maybe start with the vvt 1uz or 3uz as the best block/crank

 

[XR8tt]

Aha here's my new low milage / stroked Windsor block .. 650 h.p / 15 Lb boost and 6500 shifts didn't hold.. Have aftermarket [Dart] block now..


So 1000 H.P from a well prepped 1UZ is very good ...

 

[cribbj]

Ouch! Was there a bit of laughing gas involved in that split?

SBF blocks are famous over here for splitting down the middle like that when more than a 100 shot is applied.

 

[XR8tt]

Ouch! Was there a bit of laughing gas involved in that split?

SBF blocks are famous over here for splitting down the middle like that when more than a 100 shot is applied.

yes 650 @ the wheels was way above its strength..
As said though .. With turbo's etc ..Good ECU's now these power levels are quite easy to make..
I'm showing my age .. But I can remember when F1 run engines with 400 to 500 h.p.. Before the turbo age..
Cribbj :: No, no juice just good ole boost and too much abuse..
Live and learn !!!

 

[Armyman2445]

Aha here's my new low milage / stroked Windsor block .. 650 h.p / 15 Lb boost and 6500 shifts didn't hold.. Have aftermarket [Dart] block now..


So 1000 H.P from a well prepped 1UZ is very good ...

Probaly could have used 4 bolt mains and a grudle.

 

[XR8tt]

Probably could have used 4 bolt mains and a grudle.

Na check the webbing ?? 4 bolt mains actually reduces its strength..
Yes a mains girdle will stop it from breaking completely...
Imo WASTE OF TIME !!!
Here is a half decent Ford block.. Notice the thicker webbing ??
An R302 block.. With cutouts for stroker crank on lower cylinders..


I bought one of these dart blocks.. Capable of 2000+ h.p...
http://www.dartheads.com/products/engine-blocks/ford-blocks/ford-iron-eagle-blocks.html

 

[spf_lexus]

seems like different bolt configs are a waste of time... just starting weak spots? There's domestic consistency for ya (No pun intended lol)

 

[XR8tt]

seems like different bolt configs are a waste of time... just starting weak spots? There's domestic consistency for ya (No pun intended lol)

The 4 bolt is an R302 which has stronger webbing, similar to 351 motor..
But heavier..
The split block is a std roller H.O block..