New Motor Breakin with Standalone ECU?

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cribbj

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I have a very expensive 1UZ build nearing completion and am becoming more than a bit nervous about its initial crank up and breakin with an aftermarket standalone ECU.

This will be the first time the motor has seen the ECU, and vice versa. Matter of fact, it'll be one of the first times this ECU will be used in this application, with these injectors, etc. Lots of unknowns to sort out.....

I'm of the opinion that the first minute or two of running are the most critical for a brand new motor breakin because this is when the rings are going to have their best chance to seat....or not. This is not enough time to get a brand new EMS with brand new maps, dialed in with the proper AFR's to enhance the seating and breakin process. AMHIK. There are others who have washed cylinder walls, glazed rings and otherwise royally stuffed up a very expensive engine build during the initial breakin of the motor. It's not a popular subject, and one which professional tuners don't like to talk about, but it happens more often than the tuners care to admit.....

Using a stock ECU, the stock fuel system, a stock harness, and the stock dizzies might be one option for breakin, however I don't have any of the above, and even if I did, they might not play well with the rest of my setup.

So I'm actually considering breaking in this motor with a carburetor setup, or possibly even an ancient Impco LPG mixer setup. I would allow the ECU to control the ignition, but would turn off the injectors until I was happy with the breakin, as evidenced by good compression & leakdown numbers.

Anyone else have some actual experience with this, or know of a better solution?

John
 
With the Chevy small block rebuilds of the past I would just set the timing, crank the motor for a while using the starter motor just to work in the parts and oil, then after cranking a while I would then connect and fire it up and go from there...Never had any problems...Rebuilt 3 motors that way.... That was years back and those engines were basic small blocks and caburated compared to the dual overhead cam Fuel injection 1UZ's..

That article seems to be a little overkill to me, but why take a chance..Better safe then sorry...good luck...
 
Use some "running in" oil. Just make sure the car is running rich as the fuel will wash the oil off the walls of the bore allowing the rings and bore to bed in. Dont use LPG, as there will be no washing effect and the rings wont bed in , speaking from experience a car running on LPG can do 20000 km + and still have the original hone marks.
 
This is my opinion.

First minute or 2 is fine, its once its warm, and under load that you start to bed it in.

This is how I plan to run my next build in.

On a Dyno:
Warm the engine up
completely !!

Then, using 4th gear:

Do Three 1/2 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 60% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes

Do Three 3/4 Throttle dyno runs from
40% - 80% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes

Do Three Full Throttle dyno runs from
30% - 100% of your engine's max rpm
Let it Cool Down For About 15 Minutes
Go For It !!

taken from http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
 
What a problem you have. I hate starting new engines with new management. I always prefer to setup the new standalone before rebuilding the engine to at least get it close and iron out a few of the hickups. I would suggest you forget about the LPG and the carb and work really fast when you do your first startup. Get your oil pressure up (mineral oil only I use 15/40 or 20/50, I don't like specific running in oil) - make sure the injectors are disabled while doing this and try and adjust the base timing at the same time. If this is not possible disable the spark during cranking and set base timing as soon as possible after starting. Many standalones the timing map is close enough for a initial run anyway. When you first start it up use the overall fuel trim to adjust the mixture to close enough and go through the normal revving and warmup. If this is done right the chances of rings not bedding in are tiny. You might want to have some extra helpers around and if possible have a gas analyser on hand. Good luck. Cheers
 
Any tuner should be able to sort your tuning out close enough without any problems.
If they can't they are not a real tuner. Be carefull as there are a lot of "fake" tuners out there.
Post your setup and hardware. I may be able to come up with a base map for you.
Be aware that it takes quite a while to get the oil warmed up ~15minutes.
 
Thanks everyone for the replies. Peewee, I'm a Motoman disciple too :veryhappy

The reason I started this is because of previous experiences I and more than a few others have had with freshly built 2JZ motors being started up for the first time with a standalone ECU and the net result being a very rich breakin, with wall washing of the cylinders, glazed rings that didn't seat, and a very high oil consumption until the motor was pulled, rebuilt again, reinstalled, and broken in again with stock ECU, injectors, etc. This has been in different parts of the USA and UK, with different builders, tuners and ECU's. All of us were equipped with WBO2 AFR controllers, and at least one guy was doing his initial run in on a fully instrumented engine dyno, with Horiba equipment, and an extremely knowledgeable builder/tuner.

These engines were built right, the clearances were spot on, and the cylinder walls prepared with the correct finish, and (at least in my case) the cylinder finish was confirmed with the proper high resolution profilometer. The common thread in these mishaps seemed to be the very rich AFR during the initial warmup and hot load runs. Trust me, it really sux to watch a painstakingly prepared $15,000 motor turn into a mosquito fogger.

This is why I was considering breaking the 1UZ in on LPG; sorry Turbo355, contrary to what you are advocating, a rich breakin that results in wall washing of the cylinders is exactly the condition that ruined at least 3 of these motors. This is not just my opinion, but that of the piston ring manufacturer who did a postmortem study of his rings after one of the motors was pulled, torn down and rebuilt again.

With LPG already being in a dry gaseous state, I believe the only damage an overrich startup situation would produce would be fouled plugs.

Any builders or tuners care to share their experiences?
 
Well i've only ever been in this situation 3 times and never had a problem. Although I was tuning the engine so to speak in real time as it warmed up, so they weren't running rich for very long.
Do you have the facility to do this? You need a good A/F ratio meter and a good dyno. If your ECU is real time programmable it shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Remember that under light to medium loads you can run the engine quite lean, you shouldn't have washout problems. You should be able to get it very close during the warmup process and then move these figures on as you rev the engine up. Of course you need a dyno which can hold a steady rpm/load.
 
Thanks KDog, I think I'll bite the bullet and go for an engine dyno breakin on this motor. It'll be expensive, but considering the alternatives, they're even more expensive.

On the previous occasions the motors were installed in the car for the breakin, except for my mate's case in the UK. He broke his in on an engine dyno, but I think they just screwed around too long with a very rich AFR.

So, I'm still thinking hard about doing this with an LPG carby instead of with the injection system.

John
 

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I wonder if a FI motor would breaking differently from NA motor. As for turbo, oil quality is very important especially oil going into the turbo. I as for oil consumption, a combination of ring clearance, oil injectors and turbo oil will play a major part. As for my project (SC470TT), I will break in with stock ecu and stock setup first. Clean out the motor oils before turbos are install.
 
Another option would be to drop in a stock, used short block with your new heads, intake, etc, and build your ECU calibration on that. That way you don't have to worry about the rich fuel problems once your expensive block goes in. The only big difference should be the compresssion, but that should not affect the AFR tune really. If you don't have a spare and need to borrow one (in Austin), I think I have one available.
 
Now there's an idea....

That's kinda what happened with my 2JZ build, except once it was obvious the engine was stuffed, we went ahead and got the maps dialed in better, then pulled the motor and rebuilt it the 2nd time.

The maps and breakin still weren't completely right the 2nd time around, so it still burns a quart for every 4-5 hours of running, but at least it's not to the point of being embarrassing.

I've got a '99 VVTi block that might serve the purpose.....

John
 
Just make sure there's no mismatched piston/valve issues with that 99 moter & pre 98 heads. I'm sure it will be fine as long as the cam timing is correct.
 


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