Machining Cams from scratch

The 1UZFE EGR Delete Kit is available for sale here.

redrocco

Member
Messages
160
Location
Rochester NY
Was wondering if any one on hear has done this before? I would like a set of performance cams for my 1GZ-FE V12 and being that there's zero after market for this engine and the machine shop I work at will be getting a 7 axis Mazak turning center soon. That machine is a twin chuck CNC with a live head and could machine a cam out of a piece of bar stock with a tolerance of .001 or better. I was hoping that there was some one who had done something like this before on hear. I would still probbly need to take them to a grinding shop for finishing. So I am looking for ideas or thoughts that everyone has on this.
 
cams from solid bar

Hi Redrocco
I had a customer recently ask about the extact thing that you are planning to do... He grinds cams for a living and does low numbers and one offs for all sorts of vehicles (jet skis etc.)
I priced up for at a local company with a lathe that had live tools ($150NZD+ material) for a run of twenty (had tapped holes and a slot cut in one end) with about 0.25mm left on the cam surface.
I also got a price of $75NZD+ materials for a cnc lathe to cut the slots where the cams should be and to not finish the end holes and slot.
The guy with the grinder reckoned that he could remove the extra material with a rough grinding wheel and then finish without to much trouble...

Not sure which way he went but because he is doing such low numbers probably the cheaper of the options..

The mazak you are getting would be a great way to make the cams and the surface finish will that good that you could almost get away without grinding..

Just have a go and take lots of photos, it will be a great project to learn on..

Cheers Craig Young
 
I would agree that they would need to be ground. I am thinking that I should probbly leave .003 to .004 per side so .006 to .008 diametricly total on all surfaces for grinding. Would 4140 cromoly be the metal to use and should I have them case hardened before grinding? If any one has a real good understanding of cam profiles or knows a shop in the USA that would be willing to give me some tips or even make the cams if they can do them for a reasonable price that would be a big help. I would also be willing to make 2 or 3 sets of blanks and leave the lobes extra over size if any of the other 1GZ guys would want a set. We might be able to get a price break on the grinding if we sent in 2 to 4 sets. I will be reserching this for at least a few months and the new machine might not be hear and set up for 6 months so ime in no big hurry. Just trying to get some feed back and advice.
 
If you do not have an understanding of materials and camshaft design - go to a major after market cam manufacturer !

as a guide though
4340 crmo
rough machine
harden and temper
finish machine/grind
nitride
straighten and polish

have a very heavy wallet, it will be a lot lighter afterwards

Erol
 
I was also considering havening the stock ones welded and reground. It would be simpler and cheeper, how much cheeper I couldent say. 4U2QUIK would you be able and intersted in welding and regrinding them and if so could you give me an approximit price. There are a few places local to me who I could trust to weld and grind cams but its such a uncommon engine that I would much rather have them done by/to the specs of someone who knows alot about toyota v8's. The main reason I was thinking of making a whole new set was that if something gos wrong in the grinding I would have the stock cams as spares.
As far as making a completly new set of cams I can get the materal for almost free. I have mastercam X3 full with solids, art to vector, the full post libray ext. Eather me or one of my friends at work could rough and then finish machine them. I have a owner of a large plateing shop who owes me a favor. I know most of the guys at the bigest heat treating place around fairly well and they will often hang onto my parts for a week or two untill they have some job come in that needs the same treating and just run my parts with it. For the most part I can polish anything to nearly glass (0 to 3 finish on a profalometer) my self and the polishing department where I work is increadble. Its just the grinding and the specs to grind to that I don't have the right machine or don't know. The total cost for me other than the grinding and new lobe profile designe would probbly be less that $200. But it would be a ton of work and take months start to finish.
 
Tighe cams in Australia used to do it (may still well do it) for 1UZ's.

Wasn't all that expensive but the cam won't have the durability of a factory item.
 
I was also considering havening the stock ones welded and reground. It would be simpler and cheeper, how much cheeper I couldent say. 4U2QUIK would you be able and intersted in welding and regrinding them and if so could you give me an approximit price. There are a few places local to me who I could trust to weld and grind cams but its such a uncommon engine that I would much rather have them done by/to the specs of someone who knows alot about toyota v8's. The main reason I was thinking of making a whole new set was that if something gos wrong in the grinding I would have the stock cams as spares.
As far as making a completly new set of cams I can get the materal for almost free. I have mastercam X3 full with solids, art to vector, the full post libray ext. Eather me or one of my friends at work could rough and then finish machine them. I have a owner of a large plateing shop who owes me a favor. I know most of the guys at the bigest heat treating place around fairly well and they will often hang onto my parts for a week or two untill they have some job come in that needs the same treating and just run my parts with it. For the most part I can polish anything to nearly glass (0 to 3 finish on a profalometer) my self and the polishing department where I work is increadble. Its just the grinding and the specs to grind to that I don't have the right machine or don't know. The total cost for me other than the grinding and new lobe profile designe would probbly be less that $200. But it would be a ton of work and take months start to finish.

What it really comes down to is whay's your time worth. Honestly, it's not worth my time when you can buy a set of kelfords for 1400$ that have already been tested and have zero issues.
 
I dident know that kelford could or has made cams for the 1GZ. They don't list all there applications on there site and I would rather deal with some one in the usa to save on shipping. Do you know if they would need my cams to weld and regrind or do they just make them to order?
 
I dident know that kelford could or has made cams for the 1GZ. They don't list all there applications on there site and I would rather deal with some one in the usa to save on shipping. Do you know if they would need my cams to weld and regrind or do they just make them to order?

I think I was up posting way too late and must have had v8 on the brain. No they do not do the cams as far as i know.
 
I wonder if kelford would do a set. Not quite sure how or what time to call them though. It looks like it would cost me $2.50 a minute to call them from my cell phone. Is anyone who works for kelford on this forum, or does anyone on hear know the guys there and would be willing to ask them if its something that they would do?
 
I have international phone service so it's pennies a minute for me to call. plus I've been wanting to pick their brains about their cams for awhile now. So I may just give them a ring next week.
 
Yes our international calls are $5 an hour..
Late at night should be next morning in N.Z..
6 or 7 hours ahead,, Chicago time..DLST depending..
6.42 pm now in N.Z / 12.43 am Chicago time..
With daylight saving ..
 
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If you want them to work right and last and not mess up the rest of the engine there is more to cam design and manufacture than just having a machine that can cut metal.
You will need to calculate the accelerations for entry and exit ramps and the associated jerk. whoops just noticed how old this thread is. I'd like to know how those cams worked out?
 


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